Guns and the Bible

[Monterrey]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

LOL... I pray we can all be kept by the word in these times when we need it the most...

I'm with you on that!

[YounginHope]

Very nice Esias. That is a great OT study on this subject. We will have to disagree about murder. I feel the intentional taking of a life qualifies it murder. Whether it be justified by Gods law in the OT or not I cannot see it in the NT. I do not see where a subject as important as this can be "both ways" either.
Ps 44:5-6 5Through thee will we push down our enemies: through thy name will we tread them under that rise up against us. 6For I will not trust in my bow, neither shall my sword save me.
Ps 20:7 Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the Lord our God.

No one can deny that there was a time when God ordained his people to to defend themselves or take up arms in the OT. I fall short in seeing this in the NT. I don't see how it glorifies God and its doesn't appear a Christ-like attribute. Hard to let your light shine and bullets fly at the same time. And when pulling the trigger what fruit of the Spirit are you displaying? Will you forgive them after you kill/(murder) them? Some of what you posted certainly looked to be vengeance. Romans 12:19 covered that.

[Sean]

This subject is more complicated than we realize.

If your position is correct, then as soon as a person prays through, then they must disarm.
They must quit the police services of all types, or military likewise, etc.

[Sean]

They must not rely on any service(of violence toward evil doers) to help them in time of need.

[Sean]

How horrible they must feel to call the cops on someone, which results in the police shooting them.

[Sean]

This makes them the instigator of the violent act, themselves.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Sean

This subject is more complicated than we realize.

If your position is correct, then as soon as a person prays through, then they must disarm.
They must quit the police services of all types, or military likewise, etc.

Sean do you believe ( I personally don't believe you do) that a person needs to be led by the leading of the Holy Ghost? That if you make them change they aren't changing but really just following your own prohibitions? Even if you show them something in the Bible, they still have to get a solid understanding through the influence of God's Spirit? People who pray through get the Holy Ghost are baptized in Jesus name are infants who need to be raised by Jesus, not to be handed a yard long list of prohibitions.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by YounginHope

Very nice Esias. That is a great OT study on this subject. We will have to disagree about murder. I feel the intentional taking of a life qualifies it murder. Whether it be justified by Gods law in the OT or not I cannot see it in the NT. I do not see where a subject as important as this can be "both ways" either.
Ps 44:5-6 5Through thee will we push down our enemies: through thy name will we tread them under that rise up against us. 6For I will not trust in my bow, neither shall my sword save me.
Ps 20:7 Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the Lord our God.

No one can deny that there was a time when God ordained his people to to defend themselves or take up arms in the OT. I fall short in seeing this in the NT. I don't see how it glorifies God and its doesn't appear a Christ-like attribute. Hard to let your light shine and bullets fly at the same time. And when pulling the trigger what fruit of the Spirit are you displaying? Will you forgive them after you kill/(murder) them? Some of what you posted certainly looked to be vengeance. Romans 12:19 covered that.

One has to remember that Isreal was an invading army which occupied the land through conquest. In some cases told to kill men, women, children, and livestock. We in the New Testament are given no instruction on war, the taking of prisoners, or even a death penalty? Thomas Aquinas wrote about the theory of Just War, as many other Christian theologians. But calls us to peace? They who live by the sword shall die by it? But American Christianity presents a who shall live by the sword shall survive by it? But it may be that Jesus was trying to relay balance in the thoughts of living by the sword alone? But then where is the balance with someone slapping one side of your face to offer him the other side?
Everyone needs to be led by God on this subject, because shooting an attacker in the neck then watching as he drowns in his own blood. Never goes away.

[TJJJ]

One also has to remember that in the Old Testament, it is all about the physical. Everything was physical.

The New Testament is about the Spiritual.

Our battles that we fight in the New are not like the Old except in types and shadows.

They fought physical giants, we fight spiritual giants.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Sean

Just be glad you do not live in Iran, bro.

? Why not? I have Christian and Muslim friends there; it's a beautiful country!