Dialogue with a Muslim

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by shazeep

i never said this, either, and in fact i have repeatedly said that this has nothing to do with Muslims, but human judgement. Don't OPs tell each other "You are saved?" Haven't i told you "You are not saved, according to Scripture?" If you have not "held out to the end," by definition you cannot be saved. We lie to people to make them feel better, so they will give us money.

You missed the point...or you get it and obfuscated.

What I did was quote the word of God and pointed out what they believe. For that you accused me through implication that I do not love

So using YOUR logic you don't believe in telling others what the bible says about salvation

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

So using YOUR logic you don't believe in telling others what the bible says about salvation

Bingo. If we do it's called hatred by these sorts.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

You missed the point...or you get it and obfuscated.

What I did was quote the word of God and pointed out what they believe. For that you accused me through implication that I do not love

So using YOUR logic you don't believe in telling others what the bible says about salvation

certainly not in the same breath that you judge them with, no. And if you cannot hear what else the Bible says about salvation, and apply it, then what good are you to anyone else? But i would by all means suggest that you "tell" anyone who asks you, certainly. This is how you reveal yourself, if you listen. But if it is ok for you to be "huckleberry," then you must grant that to everyone you "tell."

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

He doesn't love them. He wrongly believes love means ignoring what the bible teaches and lying to everyone and telling them "You are saved"

True love tells the truth in love. I think he heard his family speak truth in anger that he thinks No one can speak it in love.

[shazeep]

but you must be a "huckleberry" to entertain the thought. ok.

[Esaias]

Shazeep admitted he said 'you are not saved' to us. Therefore, according to Shazeep's own rules, he doesn't love us and is not saved himself.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Shazeep admitted he said 'you are not saved' to us. Therefore, according to Shazeep's own rules, he doesn't love us and is not saved himself.

Why do you say that i don't love you because of this? Don't i actually love you if i spend time trying to "save" you? Of course you are no more saved or lost than anyone, right now, and my point there was to show how you sound to anyone else who seeks God. When did determining someone's state of salvation become the determiner for how you should treat them? Isn't this what heathens do?

Declaring someone "lost" is the height of hypocrisy, when you do not know; it is strictly a way to serve yourself. Note how you feel at being told that you are lost, and it can be proven with Scripture. Anyone can do this. Why should anyone feel any differently than you do? If you would instead seek a verse that shows how they might be saved, rather than one that "proves" how they are lost (and consider those for yourself), then you will be led to Christ, imo.

You put yourself at the head of the table, with this "We are saved, and they are lost" jazz. All the pleasant parts of Scripture apply to you, and all the unpleasant parts apply to "them." Try reading the Bible the other way around! There is no such thing as "in all humility, i will sit at the head."

[mfblume]

Of course you are no more saved or lost than anyone,

The implication is no one can say THEY ARE SAVED, past tense.

Wrong again.

1Co 1:18 KJV For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Titus 3:5 KJV Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Interesting how that is associated with the cross and and those who reject it, as well as condemning salvation by works.

But I suppose we can find anything if we want, right? Like people not needing to believe Jesus even died on a cross that they might be saved.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by shazeep

Why do you say that i don't love you because of this?

Because that is what you say. It is the logical consequence of your own reasoning, as clearly demonstrated in this and other threads. You say if a person says someone is not saved, it is only because they do not love them. You have said we are not saved. Therefore it is because you do not love us. Simple logic.

Declaring someone "lost" is the height of hypocrisy, when you do not know; it is strictly a way to serve yourself.

Prove it.

Note how you feel at being told that you are lost, and it can be proven with Scripture.

You have not proven anything by scripture. Scripture says the exact opposite to what you say. This has been shown to you time and time again, but you just repeat your claims with no support other than it is what you 'feel' or what you 'think'. By the way, I don't 'feel' anything when you say I am lost. I have already been confronted by the BIBLE which showed me I was lost, and it also showed me the solution. I agreed with the solution, the grace of Christ came into my life and saved me, is saving me, and shall continue to save me. When someone comes along and claims I am not saved, I say 'prove it by the Word of God'. If they can do it, believe me, I am Johnny on the spot to make corrections. If they cannot, if they just repeat themselves, and if they constantly contradict the plain, simple, easy to read statements of scripture, and if they constantly contradict themselves, and especially if their own claims condemn themselves by their own standard of discernment, then believe me I don't lose any sleep over their claims.

You put yourself at the head of the table, with this "We are saved, and they are lost" jazz.

Prove it.

All the pleasant parts of Scripture apply to you, and all the unpleasant parts apply to "them." Try reading the Bible the other way around! There is no such thing as "in all humility, i will sit at the head."

You are highly deceived in your opinion of me and others here. You are unwilling to accept the idea that I, and others, have indeed 'applied the unpleasant parts of Scripture' to ourselves. That is why I am a Christian. Because GOD applied the 'unpleasant parts of Scripture' to me, directly and forcibly and in such a way that I could not deny it, not one bit. That's called 'conviction'. And God also applied the HOPE OF THE GOSPEL to me, showing me from SCRIPTURE that IF I put my trust in Jesus Christ, I shall be forgiven, saved, resurrected, glorified with Him, and receive eternal life. And so I put my trust in Him, and continue to do so.

'How does one put their trust in Jesus?' Simple - believe what He said.

"He that believeth and is baptised shall be saved, he that believeth not shall be damned.'

You ought to try it.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Shazeep admitted he said 'you are not saved' to us. Therefore, according to Shazeep's own rules, he doesn't love us and is not saved himself.

Sounds like a double standard