New Birth

[mfblume]

After the people gladly received Peter's word in Acts 2 and obeyed it, counting themselves among those whom Jesus prayed for in John 17:20 as people who'd believe on Him through the apostles' word, we read the following:

Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

They continued in the apostles’ doctrine. Oh that this were the popular trend today! These people followed the doctrine of the apostles as Paul and John urged people to do. They were safe! They did what they had to do.

How many scriptures did we read about our need to continue in the apostles’ doctrine and nothing less?

Why did Luke phrase it in the way he did? Why did he distinguish those who continued in the apostles’ doctrine as, “They that gladly received his word”? It was because not everyone who heard Peter obeyed his word that day. Yes, three thousand did. But, still, not everyone did. And it’s the same today. People will hear this and not gladly receive it enough to obey it.

Peter said, “…every one of you,” when he referred them to baptism in Jesus’ name. He didn’t merely command it, but doubly stressed it by insisting each and every individual be baptized.

This was precisely how we believe on Jesus by the apostles’ words.

After Jesus prayed about everyone believing on Him through the word of the Apostles, we read of nothing preached exclusively by them until Acts Chapter 2. The very day the Spirit was poured out was the first time the Apostles preached after Jesus commanded them to teach people about repentance and remission of sins in His name.

Jesus instructed the Apostles to wait for the promise of the Father before they would proceed to minister that message. The narrative of Acts Chapter 2 has Peter no sooner having finished preaching that message, than the narrative noted the three thousand who responded continued stedfastly in the Apostles’ doctrine.

This informs us the Apostle’s doctrine was established and considered so after merely one message preached in Acts Chapter 2. That message was given in answer to people who wanted to know what they must do upon hearing of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus. It’s the message Jesus specifically told them to preach after having received the Spirit.

[Chateau d'If]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Jesus stopped at redirecting the conversation to the fact that people must be born again. Only after Nic asked how that could be did Jesus say water and Spirit and those born of the Spirit are like what happens with wind. AND He STOPPED AGAIN.

Nic then showed his unbelief and Jesus finished by having dealt with getting to first base by trusting all the Son says.

I do not use that as a proof text. Acts 2 is the proof text. Acts 2 is what Jesus told them to preach in Luke 24:47-49 BEGINNING ONLY AFTER they received the Spirit.



Agreed. But he told the disciples to BEGIN preaching what later is shown as the Acts 2:38 message. And BEGIN implies it had not been preached previously.



That is absolutely impossible because Atonement had not even been made yet by His resurrection and ascension into heaven. You are saying new birth is possible without the cross, and that is impossible. New birth is directly related to Christ's resurrection which is the newness of life we all identity with in new birth.

That thinking leads to a crossless new birth. I don't think you want to go down that road.



Sorry, but that's precisely the way it was. And I cannot stress enough for the need for you to study Luke 24:47-49 showing a message NO ONE PREACHED BEFORE, that would not be preached til after He left them and filled them with the Spirit.



...FOR LATER REFERENCE.



Wrong. No one could be born again before the atonement after the resurrection. Please think about what you are saying.

Pure fiction. Go back and read the text without trying to make it fit your preconceived ideas.

Jesus never pointed Nicodemus to a future event. The conversation was between two men and recorded by John the Beloved many years later, after the events of Acts had occurred.

Your position invalidates the entire ministry of Jesus. Any person so unlucky as to hear Jesus preach but die prior to Pentecost would never have heard your version of truth.

Jesus is salvation.

Read Romans 3, written by Paul after Pentecost.

25 For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past, 26 for he was looking ahead and including them in what he would do in this present time. God did this to demonstrate his righteousness, for he himself is fair and just, and he declares sinners to be right in his sight when they believe in Jesus.

All who believe in Messiah, before or after Pentecost, are justified by faith. That is New Birth.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Chateau d'If

Pure fiction. Go back and read the text without trying to make it fit your preconceived ideas.

It is tremendous false doctrine to say new birth occurs without the cross. I cannot describe the degree of error there. Here you go, folks. Chateau presents to you Christianity without the cross.