Pre trib rapture teaching is heresy - Page 36

Sean · #**351** 11-21-2017, 05:34 PM

NOW HERE IS HIS DISCOURSE/DIGRESSION OF THE RAPTURE...
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Jesus explained the events of the Great Tribulation, then digresses in the middle of it, then proceeds to finish the Trib's events.

"No Sean, show me it before that!"....LOL

Sean · #**352** 11-21-2017, 05:35 PM

Did you guys know that Matt 24 and 25 are the same discussion?

Esaias · #**353** 11-21-2017, 05:36 PM

Rapture cultists, here's your chance to shine and convince us all!

We're looking for at least ONE passage (just one will do!) that contains the following:

1. The return of Jesus OR
2. The gathering of the saints together with Him OR
3. The resurrection of the saints/catching up of the saints.

TOGETHER WITH

4. Any time statements about the relationship of any two of the three previous elements OR
5. Any time statements about the relationship of numbers 2 or 3 AND the following:
a) The tribulation
b) The man of sin
c) The beast and/or false prophet

OR if you can find a passage which states the resurrection of the saints/catching up of the saints occurs BEFORE the tribulation, BEFORE the revealing of the man of sin, BEFORE the rise of the beast and false prophet.

Please show your work. Thanks!

Sean · #**354** 11-21-2017, 05:38 PM

Rapture discussion....

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth....

25 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.

2 And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.

3 They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:

4 But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.

5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.

6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.

7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.

8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.

10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.

11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.

12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

There is our "secret rapture", when the "bridegroom cometh" for his bride and we "meet him" in the air.

Sean · #**355** 11-21-2017, 05:40 PM

Esaias..."Blasphemy, cultists, heretics, blankety, blank blank"....LOL

Sean · #**356** 11-21-2017, 05:42 PM

This thread is a blast!

Originalist · #**357** 11-21-2017, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean

NOW HERE IS HIS DISCOURSE/DIGRESSION OF THE RAPTURE...
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
49 And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Jesus explained the events of the Great Tribulation, then digresses in the middle of it, then proceeds to finish the Trib's events.

"No Sean, show me it before that!"....LOL

So, because there is the pronoun "That" in verse 36, the rules of grammar demand an antecedent. Thus, the secret rapture that supposedly happens 7 years prior to Christ's return must be listed in Matthew 24 somewhere prior to verse 36. Grammatical law demands it.

So please now tell us where the rapture is mentioned in Matthew 24 prior to verse 36 and according to you, prior to verse 29.

We'll wait.

Sean · #**358** 11-21-2017, 05:43 PM

Post tribbers read Revelation backwards...LOL

Sean · #**359** 11-21-2017, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by originalist

so, because there is the pronoun "that" in verse 36, the rules of grammar demand an antecedent. Thus, the secret rapture that supposedly happens 7 years prior to christ's return must be listed in matthew 24 somewhere prior to verse 36. Grammatical law demands it.

So please now tell us where the rapture is mentioned in matthew 24 prior to verse 36 and according to you, prior to verse 29.

We'll wait.

howbout verse 1....lol

Esaias · #**360** 11-21-2017, 05:45 PM

While the rapturists are vainly scrambling through their Cliff's Notes, let's look at some passages that DO meet the necessary criteria for being a proof text on the subject. Remember, we're looking for passages that specifically deal with the subject of either the Return/Coming of the Lord OR the resurrection/catching up of the saints AND the TIMING between either those two or between the latter (resurrection/catching up) and the tribulation, man of sin, or beast.

1 Corinthians 15:20-23 (20) But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. (21) For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. (22) For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. (23) But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

This passage contains the following elements: The return or coming of the Lord, the resurrection of the saints, and a time statement about the relationship of the two. It states the saints are resurrected at His coming, thus it declares the two events are simultaneous. The saints are not resurrected seven or 3.5 years prior to His coming, but AT His coming. This is a clear and decisive declaration of the "post trib resurrection" position. It is also a decisive refutation of any other view (whether pre trib, mid trib, or "pre wrath" - which is simply another variation of mid trib, and will be referred to as such from now on).