Did Jesus Wear Pants?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I agree.

I don't know if it will help, but here's what I was taught in the second UPCI church that I attended...

The Bible states:

Deuteronomy 22:5
The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.

This condemns the common pagan practice that involves cross dressing and gender bending perversion. This, along with homosexuality, was noted as an "abomination" against God. God created man and woman with obvious distinctions, and even outside of the garden, God desires that man and woman have distinction.

So, this isn't addressing style of dress, but rather the perversion of expressing one's self as the opposite gender. In and of itself, it doesn't condemn pants on a woman. In fact, this text would condemn men who wear women's pants and blouses, because they pertain to a woman.

Keep in mind, Deuteronomy 22:5 isn't the only verse of Scripture that addresses women's attire. In fact, lets' look at a text that is closer to home in that it is written to the NT church. In the NT we read...

1 Timothy 2:9
In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

A Christian woman is to adorn herself in modest apparel. Let's ask a soul searching question. Are women's pants "modest"? If we're honest about this we will acknowledge that a woman's pants are typically designed to accentuate the sex appeal of a woman's more intimate curves and body shape. Every man who has ever known a woman who wears pants knows that the first thing she might ask when trying on a new pair of pants is, "How does my bottom look in these jeans?" And as our culture has become more sexually liberated, pants have become so tight, and shaped in a manner, that leaves little to the imagination. Even women in the world who wear pants regularly will often wear a top or blouse that is long enough to cover most, if not all, of her buttocks. Why? Because they know that their pants accentuate the more intimate regions of the body.

Christian modesty is a discipline that all born again daughters of God should aspire to. It is a discipline and a practice that isn't about covering one's self, but is about revealing one's dignity and personal devotion to Jesus. No, a woman might not instantly lose her soul for wearing pants, but is she allowing herself to be 100% surrendered to Christ in her attire? Is she wanting to flaunt herself to gain the attention of men? Is she spiritually immature and in need of prayer and study? Is she in some way perhaps at odds with spiritual or domestic authority? As a woman grows in Christ, she will aspire to modesty. And we believe that in doing so, a woman will cease wearing women's pants in public.

This position actually broadens our approach, and brings a common sense reasonableness to the discussion. Sure, a woman can wear pajama pants, perhaps uniform pants (if in the military), or even sweat pants if she is just lounging around the home on a cold winter's day. Within the home there is a significant level of liberty seeing that she is in the midst of family, not the general public. The same principle is seen with regards to families who swim together in more private settings away from the eyes of the general public.

Can pants cause a woman to eventually lose her soul? It depends. If wearing pants is a part of required uniform, no. If the pants are worn for some personal reason or concern for safety, no. If the pants are warn in hazardous weather or natural environment, no. But if it is to tempt men, to be sensual, as an act of rebellion against domestic or spiritual authority, or due to a lack of prayer, study, and pursuing modesty, then the answer would be, "yes". Because such dispositions can set the soul at odds with God's will and established order for the home and church.

Modesty is a heart issue. Many women who dress modestly are not modest at heart. And many women who simply don't know any better and are untaught in the ways of God we are modest at heart might be wearing attire that is inappropriate. The key to this issue is patience, sound teaching, encouragement, and grace. Any woman who is holy in heart will aspire to modesty. And we do well to assist her with encouragement and sound teaching so that she can search the Scriptures prayerfully as she conforms herself into the image of a bride worthy of Christ's own betrothal. When taught properly legalism is avoided while modesty and true heart centered holiness is affirmed. It is my firm conviction that a woman who aspires to the Christian discipline of modesty will indeed cease wearing pants and seek more modest and feminine attire such as dresses and skirts.

We who are in Christ are at liberty from the demands of the Law and legalism. However, let us allow this liberty in Christ to be a means, or a context, wherein we freely aspire to live modest and godly lives.

In this church, standards of modesty weren't called, "Holiness Standards". They were called, "Principles of Christian Modesty", under the heading of, "Christian Disciplines". I found this to be a thoughtful, biblical, and balanced approach.

Thoughts?

Chris, do you know you can’t have any form of religion without legalism?

[JoeBandy]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I agree.

I don't know if it will help, but here's what I was taught in the second UPCI church that I attended...

The Bible states:

Deuteronomy 22:5
The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.

This condemns the common pagan practice that involves cross dressing and gender bending perversion. This, along with homosexuality, was noted as an "abomination" against God. God created man and woman with obvious distinctions, and even outside of the garden, God desires that man and woman have distinction.

So, this isn't addressing style of dress, but rather the perversion of expressing one's self as the opposite gender. In and of itself, it doesn't condemn pants on a woman. In fact, this text would condemn men who wear women's pants and blouses, because they pertain to a woman.

Keep in mind, Deuteronomy 22:5 isn't the only verse of Scripture that addresses women's attire. In fact, lets' look at a text that is closer to home in that it is written to the NT church. In the NT we read...

1 Timothy 2:9
In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

A Christian woman is to adorn herself in modest apparel. Let's ask a soul searching question. Are women's pants "modest"? If we're honest about this we will acknowledge that a woman's pants are typically designed to accentuate the sex appeal of a woman's more intimate curves and body shape. Every man who has ever known a woman who wears pants knows that the first thing she might ask when trying on a new pair of pants is, "How does my bottom look in these jeans?" And as our culture has become more sexually liberated, pants have become so tight, and shaped in a manner, that leaves little to the imagination. Even women in the world who wear pants regularly will often wear a top or blouse that is long enough to cover most, if not all, of her buttocks. Why? Because they know that their pants accentuate the more intimate regions of the body.

Christian modesty is a discipline that all born again daughters of God should aspire to. It is a discipline and a practice that isn't about covering one's self, but is about revealing one's dignity and personal devotion to Jesus. No, a woman might not instantly lose her soul for wearing pants, but is she allowing herself to be 100% surrendered to Christ in her attire? Is she wanting to flaunt herself to gain the attention of men? Is she spiritually immature and in need of prayer and study? Is she in some way perhaps at odds with spiritual or domestic authority? As a woman grows in Christ, she will aspire to modesty. And we believe that in doing so, a woman will cease wearing women's pants in public.

This position actually broadens our approach, and brings a common sense reasonableness to the discussion. Sure, a woman can wear pajama pants, perhaps uniform pants (if in the military), or even sweat pants if she is just lounging around the home on a cold winter's day. Within the home there is a significant level of liberty seeing that she is in the midst of family, not the general public. The same principle is seen with regards to families who swim together in more private settings away from the eyes of the general public.

Can pants cause a woman to eventually lose her soul? It depends. If wearing pants is a part of required uniform, no. If the pants are worn for some personal reason or concern for safety, no. If the pants are warn in hazardous weather or natural environment, no. But if it is to tempt men, to be sensual, as an act of rebellion against domestic or spiritual authority, or due to a lack of prayer, study, and pursuing modesty, then the answer would be, "yes". Because such dispositions can set the soul at odds with God's will and established order for the home and church.

Modesty is a heart issue. Many women who dress modestly are not modest at heart. And many women who simply don't know any better and are untaught in the ways of God we are modest at heart might be wearing attire that is inappropriate. The key to this issue is patience, sound teaching, encouragement, and grace. Any woman who is holy in heart will aspire to modesty. And we do well to assist her with encouragement and sound teaching so that she can search the Scriptures prayerfully as she conforms herself into the image of a bride worthy of Christ's own betrothal. When taught properly legalism is avoided while modesty and true heart centered holiness is affirmed. It is my firm conviction that a woman who aspires to the Christian discipline of modesty will indeed cease wearing pants and seek more modest and feminine attire such as dresses and skirts.

We who are in Christ are at liberty from the demands of the Law and legalism. However, let us allow this liberty in Christ to be a means, or a context, wherein we freely aspire to live modest and godly lives.

Thoughts?

You see this post brings out my opinion... Duet. 22:5 is about exactly what you stated here and not pants and dresses. But the same folks who rail about the dress code quoting this scripture ignore and/or misuse 1 Timothy 2:9. The author in Timothy is straight forward.. broided, gold ,pearls. This describes 99% of the "hairdo" I have seen in the UPC since 1972!

[1ofthechosen]

Hey Joe you never did tell me is this you behind the desk? This is still how I picture you... You commented on the woman not the guy that was clearly there. You told me Crossroads UPC I google searched that, and for some reason this guy sticks out. Tell the truth is that you Joe? Facial expression fits...

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I agree.

I don't know if it will help, but here's what I was taught in the second UPCI church that I attended...

The Bible states:

Deuteronomy 22:5
The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.

This condemns the common pagan practice that involves cross dressing and gender bending perversion. This, along with homosexuality, was noted as an "abomination" against God. God created man and woman with obvious distinctions, and even outside of the garden, God desires that man and woman have distinction.

So, this isn't addressing style of dress, but rather the perversion of expressing one's self as the opposite gender. In and of itself, it doesn't condemn pants on a woman. In fact, this text would condemn men who wear women's pants and blouses, because they pertain to a woman.

Keep in mind, Deuteronomy 22:5 isn't the only verse of Scripture that addresses women's attire. In fact, lets' look at a text that is closer to home in that it is written to the NT church. In the NT we read...

1 Timothy 2:9
In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

A Christian woman is to adorn herself in modest apparel. Let's ask a soul searching question. Are women's pants "modest"? If we're honest about this we will acknowledge that a woman's pants are typically designed to accentuate the sex appeal of a woman's more intimate curves and body shape. Every man who has ever known a woman who wears pants knows that the first thing she might ask when trying on a new pair of pants is, "How does my bottom look in these jeans?" And as our culture has become more sexually liberated, pants have become so tight, and shaped in a manner, that leaves little to the imagination. Even women in the world who wear pants regularly will often wear a top or blouse that is long enough to cover most, if not all, of her buttocks. Why? Because they know that their pants accentuate the more intimate regions of the body.

Christian modesty is a discipline that all born again daughters of God should aspire to. It is a discipline and a practice that isn't about covering one's self, but is about revealing one's dignity and personal devotion to Jesus. No, a woman might not instantly lose her soul for wearing pants, but is she allowing herself to be 100% surrendered to Christ in her attire? Is she wanting to flaunt herself to gain the attention of men? Is she spiritually immature and in need of prayer and study? Is she in some way perhaps at odds with spiritual or domestic authority? As a woman grows in Christ, she will aspire to modesty. And we believe that in doing so, a woman will cease wearing women's pants in public.

This position actually broadens our approach, and brings a common sense reasonableness to the discussion. Sure, a woman can wear pajama pants, perhaps uniform pants (if in the military), or even sweat pants if she is just lounging around the home on a cold winter's day. Within the home there is a significant level of liberty seeing that she is in the midst of family, not the general public. The same principle is seen with regards to families who swim together in more private settings away from the eyes of the general public.

Can pants cause a woman to eventually lose her soul? It depends. If wearing pants is a part of required uniform, no. If the pants are worn for some personal reason or concern for safety, no. If the pants are warn in hazardous weather or natural environment, no. But if it is to tempt men, to be sensual, as an act of rebellion against domestic or spiritual authority, or due to a lack of prayer, study, and pursuing modesty, then the answer would be, "yes". Because such dispositions can set the soul at odds with God's will and established order for the home and church.

Modesty is a heart issue. Many women who dress modestly are not modest at heart. And many women who simply don't know any better and are untaught in the ways of God we are modest at heart might be wearing attire that is inappropriate. The key to this issue is patience, sound teaching, encouragement, and grace. Any woman who is holy in heart will aspire to modesty. And we do well to assist her with encouragement and sound teaching so that she can search the Scriptures prayerfully as she conforms herself into the image of a bride worthy of Christ's own betrothal. When taught properly legalism is avoided while modesty and true heart centered holiness is affirmed. It is my firm conviction that a woman who aspires to the Christian discipline of modesty will indeed cease wearing pants and seek more modest and feminine attire such as dresses and skirts.

We who are in Christ are at liberty from the demands of the Law and legalism. However, let us allow this liberty in Christ to be a means, or a context, wherein we freely aspire to live modest and godly lives.

In this church, standards of modesty weren't called, "Holiness Standards". They were called, "Principles of Christian Modesty", under the heading of, "Christian Disciplines". I found this to be a thoughtful, biblical, and balanced approach.

Thoughts?

One of the arguments pertaining to Deut 22:5 was that it was addressing women wearing attire of warfare and weapons. So I am not sure that arguing for women to wear a military uniform works in that context.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

Hey Joe you never did tell me is this you behind the desk? This is still how I picture you... You commented on the woman not the guy that was clearly there. You told me Crossroads UPC I google searched that, and for some reason this guy sticks out. Tell the truth is that you Joe? Facial expression fits...

Bro, that is funny.

[JoeBandy]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

First, I’m sorry for the loss of your father.

Second, I don’t care how blunt posters or trolls can get.

Third, If you keep crying about how everyone is not like you then you will be considered a whiner.

Last but not least, Chris, Aquila, Tony Randal post things which causes him to get bashed. So, I guess like you bash consepente89 and I when we post what you don’t agree with.

I am glad everyone is not like me, that would make the world a very strange place. There is not one post I have made where I have cried about any one not being like me. You are a master of taking things out of context and twisting words. Bashing and disagreeing are two different things. I am sure you are a fine outstanding citizen however you come across as a …… well nevermind… you are to conceited and arrogant to see your own flaws.. so never mind... you are welcome to point out mine as I know you will but guess what I am way ahead of you I know my downfalls.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by JoeBandy

I am glad everyone is not like me, that would make the world a very strange place.

Joe I commend you on this, way to hit the ball out of the park. I don't know why I ever doubted you....

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Amanah

One of the arguments pertaining to Deut 22:5 was that it was addressing women wearing attire of warfare and weapons. So I am not sure that arguing for women to wear a military uniform works in that context.

The pants worn during the time of Christ, and before that in the near and Middle East. Were worn by soldiers, calvary, and even infantry. Trousers weren’t worn by the women. Parthian horseman wore trousers, Celtic warriors wore trousers which were adopted by the Romans.

[JoeBandy]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

Hey Joe you never did tell me is this you behind the desk? This is still how I picture you... You commented on the woman not the guy that was clearly there. You told me Crossroads UPC I google searched that, and for some reason this guy sticks out. Tell the truth is that you Joe? Facial expression fits...

Well.... what a attitude to display.. I know you are trying to be demeaning with this post.. but hey that's ok you still believe them dang ol pants on that ol lady is a hell bound issue so you ok with the establishment. You an Eb gang up with the insults I am quite bored today as I "troll" this forum!!

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

Joe I commend you on this, way to hit the ball out of the park. I don't know why I ever doubted you....