UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by n david

I believe these men being full of the HG and faith and being given to prayer and the word was more important to the Apostles than their newness in the faith.

Absolutely. My personal opinion is that the waiting period is more for the congregation to get to know them than anything. If they don’t have the things you mentioned, they could be there a decade and shouldn’t be in leadership.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Ehud

I am unsure as well. How long do you think the wait should be? Our church has no particular waiting period. When the pastor decides he knows the person well enough, into leadership they go.

For me, it depends on the role. I would also watch their lifestyle and walk with God. As Acts 6 mentions being full of the HG and wisdom and being given to prayer and the word. While I may disagree with the timeframe, I believe fruit is a good indicator.

I would not have a new convert as a Pastor.

But a new convert can do many other things.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Ehud

Absolutely. My personal opinion is that the waiting period is more for the congregation to get to know them than anything. If they don’t have the things you mentioned, they could be there a decade and shouldn’t be in leadership.

This is true.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by n david

But a new convert can do many other things.

Couldn’t agree more. Sometimes we put such emphasis on leadership roles that we forget the “little things” done by everyone else.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Ehud

Absolutely. My personal opinion is that the waiting period is more for the congregation to get to know them than anything. If they don’t have the things you mentioned, they could be there a decade and shouldn’t be in leadership.

So the verse says they were full of the HG -- that doesn't take a seasoned saint to obtain.

The verse also says full of wisdom. How long does it take to obtain wisdom? Can a new convert, even someone saved 6 months or a year, be full of wisdom?

I mean, I've been in church all my life and have found myself more than a few times lacking wisdom in certain situations.

[Tithesmeister]

The position of pastor AS WE KNOW AND UNDERSTAND IT TODAY is not found in the Bible. Plural eldership is the biblical model. CEO-ship is not found in the early church.

Who was the pastor of the Jerusalem church?

Rome?

Corinth?

Can you name the pastor of ANY church in the NT?

When Paul knew be was about to be imprisoned when he got to Jerusalem, and he was not going to see the church of Ephesus anymore, who did he ask to come to Miletus and meet him?

Was it the pastor?

Acts 20

[17] And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the church.

Funny he never mentioned the pastor. Maybe the elders were ALL pastors? How did they ever have church without one single pastor to call the shots?

We have found a better way. ��

The pastor/king/pope/CEO.

[Ehud]

Originally Posted by n david

So the verse says they were full of the HG -- that doesn't take a seasoned saint to obtain.

The verse also says full of wisdom. How long does it take to obtain wisdom? Can a new convert, even someone saved 6 months or a year, be full of wisdom?

I mean, I've been in church all my life and have found myself more than a few times lacking wisdom in certain situations.

Very good questions. Perhaps that is where the fruit should be emphasized and time frames viewed as minimums? As you said earlier, the role being filled must come into play as well. It’s hard to imagine a new convert should be quickly trusted with a teaching role.

[Apostolic1ness]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

Six months?

One year plus?

How about straightway?

This is referring to the Apostle Paul.


Acts 9

[20] And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.

Sounds more like six DAYS!

Paul said the bishops could not be a novice and the decons likewise must be proved. This takes time.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by n david

You're absolutely right. The verse's designation of him as a proselyte could be more about his origin than newness in the faith. But that makes me question why it didn't refer to the others as proselytes.

I'm just thinking out loud.

I believe these men being full of the HG and wisdom and being given to prayer and the word was more important to the Apostles than their newness in the faith.

Again, just thinking out loud ... you have 120 in the upper room and 3,000 saved in one day, with multitudes added every day ... there had to have been absolute new converts who rose up to spread the gospel and lead others to Christ.

The Bible does not specify any specific time period for appointment as deacon or overseer. It does warn against appointing novices and says appointees must be tested. The actual time frame is therefore dependent upon whoever is doing the appointing. Thus it may vary from church to church and appointee to appointee. Each situation is different, there is no standardised fill in the blank automated process.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Nope, as for me, it just makes me lose my focus. Better not knowing a thing, when you tag it down to the last detail. That way everyone knows it was Jesus coming around taking names. Especially the pastor. Time spent in the pastor’s office is better spent on our knees in the prayer room.

I understand what you are saying. Also I'm not talking about an evangelist getting the details on some individual saint's issues from the pastor.

Although I do notice Paul often dealt with local church issues based on information relayed to him from elders, ministers, or whoever. So it seems that both approaches are valid?