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Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other.


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  #211  
Old 06-19-2007, 12:47 PM
mizpeh mizpeh is offline
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Originally Posted by JTULLOCK View Post
Were you "seduced" into almost believing in the Trinity? Who seduced you? This thing is not about seduction. You see it or you don't. You see things are right or you don't. It is that simple.
Almost.

I thought it was a man and his intellect but in truth it was a spirit compelling me into false doctrine. This is something that God showed me in a dream. Take it or leave it. When I first had the dream and a sister in the church interpreted part of it (this is someone who doesn't delve into dream interpretation whatsoever) , I thought 'no way, I'm solid on what I believe' but when it came to pass and my ground was literally shaking, I knew that God had forewarned me.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
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  #212  
Old 06-19-2007, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
Did anyone actually read what our trinitarian friends say they believe persons means?

b. Distinction and Relationship in the Godhead
Christ taught a distinction of Persons in the Godhead which He expressed in specific terms of relationship, as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, but that this distinction and relationship, as to its mode is inscrutable and incomprehensible, because unexplained.


c. Unity of the One Being of Father, Son and Holy Spirit
Accordingly, therefore, there is that in the Father which constitutes him the Father and not the Son; there is that in the Son which constitutes Him the Son and not the Father; and there is that in the Holy Spirit which constitutes Him the Holy Spirit and not either the Father or the Son. Wherefore the Father is the Begetter, the Son is the Begotten, and the Holy Spirit is the one proceeding from the Father and the Son. Therefore, because these three persons in the Godhead are in a state of unity, there is but one Lord God Almighty and His name one.


d. Identity and Cooperation in the Godhead
The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are never identical as to Person; nor confused as to relation; nor divided in respect to the Godhead; nor opposed as to cooperation. The Son is in the Father and the Father is in the Son as to relationship. The Son is with the Father and the Father is with the Son, as to fellowship. The Father is not from the Son, but the Son is from the Father, as to authority. The Holy Spirit is from the Father and the Son proceeding, as to nature, relationship, cooperation and authority. Hence, neither Person in the Godhead either exists or works separately or independently of the others.

I for one have read it, and I understand the trinity as proposed by trinitarians. the following
c. Unity of the One Being of Father, Son and Holy Spirit
Accordingly, therefore, there is that in the Father which constitutes him the Father and not the Son; there is that in the Son which constitutes Him the Son and not the Father; and there is that in the Holy Spirit which constitutes Him the Holy Spirit and not either the Father or the Son. Wherefore the Father is the Begetter, the Son is the Begotten, and the Holy Spirit is the one proceeding from the Father and the Son. Therefore, because these three persons in the Godhead are in a state of unity, there is but one Lord God Almighty and His name one.


is why I recite the poem
Roses are Red
Violets are Blue
I’m schizophrenic
and so am I
and so am I

God.
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  #213  
Old 06-19-2007, 12:56 PM
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sola gratia sola gratia is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferd View Post
I for one have read it, and I understand the trinity as proposed by trinitarians. the following
c. Unity of the One Being of Father, Son and Holy Spirit
Accordingly, therefore, there is that in the Father which constitutes him the Father and not the Son; there is that in the Son which constitutes Him the Son and not the Father; and there is that in the Holy Spirit which constitutes Him the Holy Spirit and not either the Father or the Son. Wherefore the Father is the Begetter, the Son is the Begotten, and the Holy Spirit is the one proceeding from the Father and the Son. Therefore, because these three persons in the Godhead are in a state of unity, there is but one Lord God Almighty and His name one.


is why I recite the poem
Roses are Red
Violets are Blue
I’m schizophrenic
and so am I
and so am I

God.
oh I see but modalism takes care of all that? Sheesh whatever....
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  #214  
Old 06-19-2007, 12:59 PM
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Jack Shephard Jack Shephard is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh View Post
Almost.

I thought it was a man and his intellect but in truth it was a spirit compelling me into false doctrine. This is something that God showed me in a dream. Take it or leave it. When I first had the dream and a sister in the church interpreted part of it (this is someone who doesn't delve into dream interpretation whatsoever) , I thought 'no way, I'm solid on what I believe' but when it came to pass and my ground was literally shaking, I knew that God had forewarned me.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
I will take it God can do anything. That may have been your fight but not everyone may fight the same stuff, ya feel?
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  #215  
Old 06-19-2007, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by sola gratia View Post
oh I see but modalism takes care of all that? Sheesh whatever....
can't you at least appreciate the humor?

and yes. Modalism in one or more of its forms takes care of all that.
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  #216  
Old 06-19-2007, 01:10 PM
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sola gratia sola gratia is offline
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modalism does not... it has so many doctrinal and scriptural issues with it... its silly
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  #217  
Old 06-19-2007, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by sola gratia View Post
modalism does not... it has so many doctrinal and scriptural issues with it... its silly
you didnt catch the "in one or more of its forms"

did you?


but still, you have to see the humor in this....
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  #218  
Old 06-19-2007, 01:49 PM
Chan
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Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
From the AOG website statement of faith:

The One True God
The one true God has revealed Himself as the eternally self-existent "I AM," the Creator of heaven and earth and the Redeemer of mankind. He has further revealed Himself as embodying the principles of relationship and association as Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

The Adorable Godhead

a. Terms Defined
The terms "Trinity" and "persons" as related to the Godhead, while not found in the Scriptures, are words in harmony with Scripture, whereby we may convey to others our immediate understanding of the doctrine of Christ respecting the Being of God, as distinguished from "gods many and lords many." We therefore may speak with propriety of the Lord our God who is One Lord, as a trinity or as one Being of three persons, and still be absolutely scriptural.

b. Distinction and Relationship in the Godhead
Christ taught a distinction of Persons in the Godhead which He expressed in specific terms of relationship, as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, but that this distinction and relationship, as to its mode is inscrutable and incomprehensible, because unexplained.


c. Unity of the One Being of Father, Son and Holy Spirit
Accordingly, therefore, there is that in the Father which constitutes him the Father and not the Son; there is that in the Son which constitutes Him the Son and not the Father; and there is that in the Holy Spirit which constitutes Him the Holy Spirit and not either the Father or the Son. Wherefore the Father is the Begetter, the Son is the Begotten, and the Holy Spirit is the one proceeding from the Father and the Son. Therefore, because these three persons in the Godhead are in a state of unity, there is but one Lord God Almighty and His name one.


d. Identity and Cooperation in the Godhead
The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are never identical as to Person; nor confused as to relation; nor divided in respect to the Godhead; nor opposed as to cooperation. The Son is in the Father and the Father is in the Son as to relationship. The Son is with the Father and the Father is with the Son, as to fellowship. The Father is not from the Son, but the Son is from the Father, as to authority. The Holy Spirit is from the Father and the Son proceeding, as to nature, relationship, cooperation and authority. Hence, neither Person in the Godhead either exists or works separately or independently of the others.



Don't tell me they don't hold to the concept of PERSONS!!!!!!!!
Did you notice that they never actually defined "persons."

And doesn't this sound a lot like the Roman Catholic "it's a mystery" excuse: "but that this distinction and relationship, as to its mode is inscrutable and incomprehensible, because unexplained."
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  #219  
Old 06-19-2007, 01:53 PM
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ManOfWord ManOfWord is offline
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Modalism, in its pure form, is not oneness. Modalsim states that God cannot be in more than one "mode" at a time.

I am not a modalist.
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  #220  
Old 06-19-2007, 01:54 PM
Chan
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Originally Posted by JTULLOCK View Post
I agree persona is the best word to use. I think there are alot of Trinitarians that are confused on what they believe just like it seems some oneness people are.
That confusion increases when people like John Ankerberg specifically define "persons" as "centers of consciousness" (as he did in his book on cults). Most trinitarians have never studied the doctrine and only parrot what they've heard their pastors and others say about it. Even my former pastor admitted to me that he had never actually studied the doctrine for himself and that he just took it for granted.
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