UPCI Church fires youth pastor

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

We do discuss these situations because these situations are arising more openly now because of the day and age we live in.

And this is a good thing. It's a shame that any of these things were kept hidden in the past.

Some suggest we take every situation, a case by case method.

No one would advocate such a position for any other kind of violent crime. But somehow sexual assault has to be discussed and options considered?

Some say call the police because the church isn't equipped to handle any of these situations.

Quite so. The powers that be are the one who don't bear the sword in vain. That honor is not bequeathed upon the church.

Some say a person that commits assault is a rapist.

Quite right. The words rape, rapist, and etc. comes from the word "rapine", which means a to seize or carry off by force, particularly in the form of plunder, that is, to pillage, but, as derived from Latin, also of the seizing and carrying off of women.

Any time a person is seized and forced into a sexual situation against their will, is by definition, an act of rapine, that is, rape. Brother Benincasa has it right.

I’m not shocked by what you said about the church, however thinking the justice system is the right way to go at every situation can be debated. Ask the men and women who have been wrongfully accused and the justice didn’t see that, and it ruined their life.

What a cop out. Because someone somewhere has had a bad time of it when it comes to the justice system, you might decide against not acting in a just and right manner and call the police if or when a member in your church gets accused of a crime?

Suppose someone in your church is accused of fraud, or theft, or some other kind of violence. Suppose a child in Sunday school asks prayer for their daddy because sometimes he hits mommy, and it comes to you. You're just going to handle it in house?

Could’ve the church with discretion been able to stop the situation from getting out of hand?

Brother, in a perfect world, we'd all be able to save the day before the day goes to hell. We aren't talking fixing things before they're not broken. This whole discussion is about what happens after something breaks.

Secondly, how do you know what is and isn't "out of hand" when it comes to the law? Are you a criminal justice expert? And just because you think you have a situation well in hand, doesn't mean you do.

I will NEVER say the church is not able to handle any situation, because you’re not speaking against me as a pastor, or a youth leader, or an elder you’re speaking against the one that started this church, with his own blood.

Keep your threats to yourself.

It's precisely because I fear the Lord, and trust Him and believe His Word, that I advocate that the police should be called whenever an accusation of a sexual abuse is made.

If an accusation is false, we commit ourselves to the Lord and trust in His righteousness to work on our behalf.

2 Peter 2:19-21 (ESV),

19 For this is a gracious thing, when, mindful of God, one endures sorrows while suffering unjustly. 20 For what credit is it if, when you sin and are beaten for it, you endure? But if when you do good and suffer for it you endure, this is a gracious thing in the sight of God. 21 For to this you have been called, because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, so that you might follow in his steps.

Genesis 50:15-21 (ESV),

15 When Joseph's brothers saw that their father was dead, they said, “It may be that Joseph will hate us and pay us back for all the evil that we did to him.” 16 So they sent a message to Joseph, saying, “Your father gave this command before he died: 17 ‘Say to Joseph, “Please forgive the transgression of your brothers and their sin, because they did evil to you.”’ And now, please forgive the transgression of the servants of the God of your father.” Joseph wept when they spoke to him. 18 His brothers also came and fell down before him and said, “Behold, we are your servants.” 19 But Joseph said to them, “Do not fear, for am I in the place of God? 20 As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good, to bring it about that many people[b] should be kept alive, as they are today. 21 So do not fear; I will provide for you and your little ones.” Thus he comforted them and spoke kindly to them.

Sometimes when we suffer wrongly or unjustly at the hands of those who would do us harm, it allows us a chance to fulfill our calling to follow in Christ's footsteps, and suffer with Him.

And enduring that suffering faithfully, like Joseph, can be the will of God, to bring about the salvation of many, even the ones who wronged us to begin with.

Romans 5:3-5 (ESV),

3 ...we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, 4 and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, 5 and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

Romans 8:18 (ESV),

18 For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worth comparing with the glory that is to be revealed to us.

Philippians 1:29 (ESV),

29 For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake...

I could go on and on about having to suffer in this life, and being falsely accused can sometimes be one of those things we suffer.

But no matter how hard that might end up being, we cannot excuse ourselves from doing the right thing. Loving justice demands it.

[diakonos]

Thanks for bringing some sense into the conversation.