Calling all PAJCers: When does Justification and Remission Happen?

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

However you want to slice it, they had no access to the benefits of the covenant without it. None.

Circumcision was pretty much a cut and dried issue...no pun intended.

CS ... we would love to here from you on this topic ... Justified at step 1, 2 or 3?

[stmatthew]

Question..... Is it the death of Jesus that Justifies us, or his resurrection?

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Felicity

Epleyian PAJCer? Now that's a new one I've never heard before.

Actually ... Sabellius shared earlier that those PAJCers that believe justification occurs before baptism subscribe to the soteriological theory of Daniel Seagraves ... making them SEAGRAVIAN PAJCers.

Those that believe that justification is not complete after 3 steps are adherents of Bernard's views .... making them the BERNARDIAN PAJCers.

And well I don't know of any Oneness theologians with the step 2 justification view ... so I could only think of Elder Epley ... therefore ...
they will be forever dubbed EPLEYIAN PAJCers.

[Felicity]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Question..... Is it the death of Jesus that Justifies us, or his resurrection?

Are you asking because you don't know? For information? Or is this a trick question?

[Coonskinner]

Let me throw out these verses...

Rom 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.


Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.


Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Reconciliation alone does not complete salvation.

Justification alone does not complete salvation.

Sanctification alone does not complete salvation.

The attempt to try to isolate a point somewhere in the process where a person is "saved" is pointless.

I guess if you have to label me, I am more in line with Bernard's view.

The full benefits of saving faith are not ours until our obedience is complete.

That includes repentance, baptism in Jesus Name, and receiving the Holy Ghost.

[SDG]

Well ... there you have it ... Coon is a BERNARDIAN PAJCer.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

Let me throw out these verses...




Reconciliation alone does not complete salvation.

Justification alone does not complete salvation.

Sanctification alone does not complete salvation.

The attempt to try to isolate a point somewhere in the process where a person is "saved" is pointless.

I guess if you have to label me, I am more in line with Bernard's view.

The full benefits of saving faith are not ours until our obedience is complete.

That includes repentance, baptism in Jesus Name, and receiving the Holy Ghost.

How do you reconcile you 3 step justification model with Romans 5:9??

Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

[Steve Epley]

I vote for me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

When remission of sins are enjoined then I am justified and He lives in me through the HG. Blood-water-Spirit! Is the new birth.

[Coonskinner]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

How do you reconcile you 3 step justification model with Romans 5:9??

Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Elements, not steps.

There is no contradiction.

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

I'm a little confused you first stated justification happens at water baptism but the verse you've provided ... if to be taken that you are a WATER AND SPIRIT adherent ... clearly states that ye are justified in the name of the Lord and by the Spirit of God.

At which step DWW??? 2 or 3?

I appreciate your willingness to share the Word with us.

I appreciate your appreciation.

In this order washed, sanctified, justified and it's all or nut'n honey. It's all one big step of faith!