Still In Shock in Tampa!

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

CC1 get me a

You obviously don't have basic reading comprehension either!

You are both fighting a fight that has never existed as far as I am concerned.

An old Indian proverb said, don't judge another man until you walk a mile in his moccasins.

You and CC1 would both do well to heed the old Indian's advice. Plow your field and leave me to plow mine and don't sit over there and tell others why it is I plow my rows the way I do. You just don't have any idea!

Originally Posted by philjones

every conservative as some weak, insipid loser who is hiding behind the skirts of separation.

if the shoe fits...

I mean, go back and read your posts, you really do sound like that...

you go "if you came from the addictions and the sin I come from you'd understand" like that is some validation of everything you do and then you assume that because someone else didn't do all the bad stuff you did that they don't have the right to speak on what is right or what is wrong...

you don't have to have been an addict to know drugs are bad or to speak about how something is right or wrong...

Originally Posted by philjones

You obviously don't have basic reading comprehension either!

You are both fighting a fight that has never existed as far as I am concerned.

An old Indian proverb said, don't judge another man until you walk a mile in his moccasins.

You and CC1 would both do well to heed the old Indian's advice. Plow your field and leave me to plow mine and don't sit over there and tell others why it is I plow my rows the way I do. You just don't have any idea!

wait...

you know what, its too easy... I just can't...

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

Philly, I mean Philtor, um Phil, I was addressing your post to him because it confirms what I have been saying the whole time. You have said things about my coming to God and your being sooo deep into sin. That is why I responded to your post.

Where did I say anything about your coming to God? I asked about your frame of reference and then I advised that you unless you have been where the other man is you have no idea why he is as he is. This was concerning your expression of consternation at the conservatism of Bro. Booker. Once again I implore you to go read what I wrote not what you want me to have written so you can judge me.



Brother it seems as if you have no clue what you are talking about. Honestly even though CC1 has not left the church the whole time does not negate what he has done in life. I am not out to defend CC1. I am not trying to down play your life either. Brother, it is not your job to judge people. You know what though you are doing so by what you are saying, that Philly is elitism.

Here you go again. I am not the one judging. CC1 judged both Benincasa and me. I am simply asserting that he cannot do that for the same reason I advised you not to try to figure out why Bro. Booker is the way he is. You have not been where he has been and had the experiences he has had. Just accept that we are different and STOP with the judging. You talk about straw men and foolish contentions for an argument that doesn't exist...your post is the empitome!

I am through here. You obviously are being intentionally obtuse and I do not have the time to attempt communicating with you. If you decide you would like to have an honest discourse, let me know. Until then don't bother trying to engage me, Judge Tullock!

RC,

If you are replying to me, I cannot see them as I have you on ignore.

Thanks,

Originally Posted by philjones

RC,

If you are replying to me, I cannot see them as I have you on ignore.

Thanks,

why am I not surprised?

[Jack Shephard]

`

Originally Posted by philjones

CC1,

Are you blind or are you just choosing not to read what I am posting?

I am telling you that you have no idea why I am conservative. You assert that folks like me or Benincasa are conservative because we find it to be a "safe haven" as though we are using our consecration as a hiding place so we don't have to face the real world.

You, sir, are not in a position to determine that. If you think you are then you are filled with a spirit of self righteous elitism. I am not a "I see a legalist behind every bush" person like JTullock, so I won't say that you are legalistic in your attitude. However, if JTullock measured you like he measures everyone else HE would probably call you a judgmental legalist!

You guys can't see the forest for the trees so I give up! Wander on from tree to tree and I will recognized that each tree is a part of the forest. I will maintain my balance and call you brother and value your contributions to the kingdom and you keep on vilifying and belittling every conservative as some weak, insipid loser who is hiding behind the skirts of separation.

Excuse me while I go throw up!

Originally Posted by philjones

You obviously don't have basic reading comprehension either!

You are both fighting a fight that has never existed as far as I am concerned.

An old Indian proverb said, don't judge another man until you walk a mile in his moccasins.

You and CC1 would both do well to heed the old Indian's advice. Plow your field and leave me to plow mine and don't sit over there and tell others why it is I plow my rows the way I do. You just don't have any idea!

Originally Posted by philjones

I am through here. You obviously are being intentionally obtuse and I do not have the time to attempt communicating with you. If you decide you would like to have an honest discourse, let me know. Until then don't bother trying to engage me, Judge Tullock!

Hey CC1 it looks as if he is giving up. Yea for us!

Phil, truth is that no one is telling anyone how to plow the field. I am trying to show you why I plow at all. You are trying to show me that you have to plow it, no other options but plow. Also you tell that we have to plow with the exact same equipment you use. Sounds silly?

I do not consider myself a judge. If you are feeling that I am judging you I am sorry you are wrong. I will be honest with you I don't care what your convictions are or anyone for that matter. I want to know if you show mercy, love God, full of the spirit. Those are the things that matter to Mr. JTullock. I appreciate yours and everyone else conviction, but they do not mean anything to me because they are personal convictions. That is how it should be. However, CC1, I and other mod/libs do not get the same treatment from some of the UC's out there. We are always measured by your measuring sticks. You and some others never allow God to measure us because you are so caught up in measuring us.

I will agree to disagree on this front, but you must not in the future attacl people that do not believe the same as you do. The elitest mentality does not become you very well. Bro. you may not be a legalist at your core, but we can only go with the info we have in front of us. Do you wish now to continue this conversation?

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

`





Hey CC1 it looks as if he is giving up. Yea for us!

Phil, truth is that no one is telling anyone how to plow the field. I am trying to show you why I plow at all. You are trying to show me that you have to plow it, no other options but plow. Also you tell that we have to plow with the exact same equipment you use. Sounds silly?

I do not consider myself a judge. If you are feeling that I am judging you I am sorry you are wrong. I will be honest with you I don't care what your convictions are or anyone for that matter. I want to know if you show mercy, love God, full of the spirit. Those are the things that matter to Mr. JTullock. I appreciate yours and everyone else conviction, but they do not mean anything to me because they are personal convictions. That is how it should be. However, CC1, I and other mod/libs do not get the same treatment from some of the UC's out there. We are always measured by your measuring sticks. You and some others never allow God to measure us because you are so caught up in measuring us.

I will agree to disagree on this front, but you must not in the future attacl people that do not believe the same as you do. The elitest mentality does not become you very well. Bro. you may not be a legalist at your core, but we can only go with the info we have in front of us. Do you wish now to continue this conversation?

Brother,

i am going to try this one last time.

The things that were said to CC1 in my first post to him were intentionally asinine... I was saying things to him a legalist would say in an effort show him how it feels to a man who is conservative by choice when someone says that he is conservative because he can't face the real world and is hiding behind the skirts of legalism.

If you can comprehend this then I will continue discussing this with you. If you cannot clearly state that you are clear on the above paragraph, continuing this discussion would be futile.

Your response will determine mine.

Just as an FYI... let me copy and paste one of my posts from another thread. DA PMd me and asked me to weigh in on the topic and I did.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
This is a quite aggressive article from someone outside of the org. I will comment on this later this evening.

PP,

I agree that the article is aggressive... but is it wrong? Have we as a movement (not just the UPC) lost the proper perspective... the ability to see things in their relative importance? Has our emphasis so shifted from the vanishing point that we have become a skewed, unfocused picture of what God intended us to be? Has the Kingdom of God (righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Ghost) been lost in the trappings of meat and drink? Have we disinherited our spiritually born, full blood brethren when only the earnest of the inheritance is actually ours? Have we sought our differences to the detriment of our likeness?

I am concerned that one of the other things that accompanies devolution is often genocide. God forbid that we would bite and devour one another as though we were the enemy.

The UPC needs to reestablish itself on the basic and fundamental doctrine as stated in the articles of faith and they need to recommit to the principle of unity!

Enough of my rambling... I will try to respond in a more structured manner later.

This is who I am. Believe it.... Or not!

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by philjones

Brother,

i am going to try this one last time.

The things that were said to CC1 in my first post to him were intentionally asinine... I was saying things to him a legalist would say in an effort show him how it feels to a man who is conservative by choice when someone says that he is conservative because he can't face the real world and is hiding behind the skirts of legalism.

If you can comprehend this then I will continue discussing this with you. If you cannot clearly state that you are clear on the above paragraph, continuing this discussion would be futile.

Your response will determine mine.

Just as an FYI... let me copy and paste one of my posts from another thread. DA PMd me and asked me to weigh in on the topic and I did.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
This is a quite aggressive article from someone outside of the org. I will comment on this later this evening.

PP,

I agree that the article is aggressive... but is it wrong? Have we as a movement (not just the UPC) lost the proper perspective... the ability to see things in their relative importance? Has our emphasis so shifted from the vanishing point that we have become a skewed, unfocused picture of what God intended us to be? Has the Kingdom of God (righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Ghost) been lost in the trappings of meat and drink? Have we disinherited our spiritually born, full blood brethren when only the earnest of the inheritance is actually ours? Have we sought our differences to the detriment of our likeness?

I am concerned that one of the other things that accompanies devolution is often genocide. God forbid that we would bite and devour one another as though we were the enemy.

The UPC needs to reestablish itself on the basic and fundamental doctrine as stated in the articles of faith and they need to recommit to the principle of unity!

Enough of my rambling... I will try to respond in a more structured manner later.

This is who I am. Believe it.... Or not!

I understand what you are saying.

I disagree with you on one point here. It is when you said "the UPC needs to reestablish itself on the basic and fundamental doctrine as stated in the articles of faith..." I do not think the UPC needs to change the way it is right now. My point is that the United Pentecostal Church calls itself an Acts 2 church. If that is truth the Acts 2 church is a progressive church. It is an original church not a copy not a bylaw driven church, not a organization but a fellowship. The church in Acts 2 were visionaries and ahead of their time. But now the UPC has, IMO, gotten behind the times. You can not be progressive by holding on to the past.

The church in Acts 2 turned the world upside down. But the traditons of man make the will of God of no affect. Progressive, not in the negative light that some cons believe, but progressive idea making to reach the lost. Do you agree? I believe with the passing of the Res 4 is a good sign that the UPC is getting into a progressive state. TV IS NOT THE END ALL, but it is a valid form of outreach. But what happened is it eliminated alot of boundaries that were unessasary and held some churches back from their potential. Now with certain walls taken down we can do things to reach further.

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

I understand what you are saying.

I disagree with you on one point here. It is when you said "the UPC needs to reestablish itself on the basic and fundamental doctrine as stated in the articles of faith..." I do not think the UPC needs to change the way it is right now. My point is that the United Pentecostal Church calls itself an Acts 2 church. If that is truth the Acts 2 church is a progressive church. It is an original church not a copy not a bylaw driven church, not a organization but a fellowship. The church in Acts 2 were visionaries and ahead of their time. But now the UPC has, IMO, gotten behind the times. You can not be progressive by holding on to the past.

The church in Acts 2 turned the world upside down. But the traditons of man make the will of God of no affect. Progressive, not in the negative light that some cons believe, but progressive idea making to reach the lost. Do you agree? I believe with the passing of the Res 4 is a good sign that the UPC is getting into a progressive state. TV IS NOT THE END ALL, but it is a valid form of outreach. But what happened is it eliminated alot of boundaries that were unessasary and held some churches back from their potential. Now with certain walls taken down we can do things to reach further.

Brother,

It is just too funny... you are intent on judging me unfairly. In the entire TV debate I have NEVER stated my position pro or con. It is not a fight that nedds to be fought.

I am for progessive methods... just not at the expense of fundemental doctrine OF SALVATION!!!!!

You need to accept that I am not an ultra con.. I just have the capacity to love them just as much as I love the ultra liberal and the capacity not judge them but to let them work out their own salvation.

Just curious, why are you so intent on disagreeing with me and others?

I am comfortable with both groups because I realized 8.5 years ago when I came back to my Father's house that my relationship with Jesus is one on one. I can't serve him for you and you cannot serve him for me.

Now... if you will just stop... not judging... PREjudging me... maybe we could have a normal conversation.

Have a good day!