Defining God

[Cindy]

Seek and ye shall find. To me the term "finding God" somehow imply's God is lost. In actuality I believe He chooses to "find" us. God did not sever a relationship with man, we did.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

Excellent. We "know" a great deal about God in terms of our own self knowledge and perception of creation. Even so, God knows each one of us intimately, but we still lack an intimate knowledge of our creator. This lack of intimacy creates a number of relational issues for humans - and makes discussing God and His nature rather difficult.

Faith (our hope, trust and confidence) in the revealed creator is the starting point in establishing a viable relationship with Him - and in this process, we can begin to discover more about the very nature of God, the who and what He truly is - that transcends our ability to comprehend Him without the use of anthropomorphic symbols.
So, cneasttx has brought us to the point of acknowledging two things concerning our discussing God: (1) We must know something about Him and (2) We must have (a measure of) faith in Him.

What then would be a good next step in being able to define (discuss) God? Or, what are some of the things that hinder such discussions?

What is wrong with anthropomophic symbols? They are found all throughout the Bible. I don't see how they can be avoided. Even God uses them to describe Himself so He can help us relate to Him.

Deut 32: 39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. 40 For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.

[bkstokes]

This reply may not be exactly directed at your question, but I think it will aid us in our search. The Lord Jesus is the "Heart Knower". (Stanley Horton) I am not, but I do believe that one of the purposes of your question could be that we are not too dogmatic with what knowledge we do have.

Norman Geisler in his book Christian Apologetics writes:

This leaves us with three basic alternatives with repect to knowledge about God. First, we can know nothing about God; he is unknowable. Second, we can know everything about God; he is completely and exhaustively knowable. Third, we can know something about God but not everything ; he is partially knowable. The first position we will call agnosticism; the second dogmatism; and the last, realism. (p. 20)

According to this definition, I would say that we are all realist. We depend upon the Word of God and the Spirit of God to gives us our knowledge of God. As Paul writes, we know in part (I Cor 13:12). Thus, we cannot ever become too dogmatic.

[A.W. Bowman]

Originally Posted by bkstokes

I think Dr. Larry Crab has written a descent book "Finding God" that addresses a lot of these questions. I will post some info from his book later.

Very good - perhaps that will assist us all! Thanks.

[Raven]

It's that mystery of the unknown that beckons me onward. What I did believe by faith, I now know by experience. Those that are content will go no further. Those that aren't thirsty will never drink afresh. Those that aren't hungry will not be filled. God's Grand Plan involves the basic motivation of incentive. Seek and ye shall find. Ask and it shall be given. Knock and it shall be opened. Draw nigh to God and He will draw nigh unto you.
God is knowable but only to the extent that 10 million years from now we will still be excitedly discovering His beauty.
Raven

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Raven

It's that mystery of the unknown that beckons me onward. What I did believe by faith, I now know by experience. Those that are content will go no further. Those that aren't thirsty will never drink afresh. Those that aren't hungry will not be filled. God's Grand Plan involves the basic motivation of incentive. Seek and ye shall find. Ask and it shall be given. Knock and it shall be opened. Draw nigh to God and He will draw nigh unto you.
God is knowable but only to the extent that 10 million years from now we will still be excitedly discovering His beauty.
Raven

God has human psychology down pat!

One of the purposes of the Son of God was to reveal the Father to us. So we might know God and how God expects us to live through Christ more perfectly.

[Sam]

25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.
26 Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight.
27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him. Matthew 11:25-27

10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. Isaiah 43:10-11

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called the Angel of great counsel, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. Isaiah 9:6-7

23 Thus saith the LORD, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches:
24 But let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth me, that I am the LORD which exercise lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the LORD.
Jeremiah 9:23, 24

20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life. 1 John 5:20

[A.W. Bowman]

I truly appreciate the comments offered to date, but we are still sailing around on the surface. That is, discussing things "about God" and concerning God, but moving away from the addressing the original question.

Even the issue of using anthropomorphisms to describe our God is only an initial step in this process. Again, I refer back to the original question.

Who here, actually knows God and can describe Him in terms of God's own reality, rather than our own finite limits? Who has looked into the eyes of infinity with understanding and wisdom?

What I am looking for is the process for transitioning from spiritually childish concepts to the mature understand of who and what God actually is. Not the old man on a cloud picture for five year olds, and not the "mighty hand of God" for those who know not that God is Spirit, I know a number of people who know a lot about Abraham Lincoln and George Washiton, even to what that ate at different meals, but I never met anyone who actually knew these men.

So, let us turn our attention back to spiritual realities and concepts that approach the infinite. Those of us who claim to know know God should also have the ability to describe Him. Looking for a pat answer, such as, "its in the Bible" will not make it - by its self. Including Book chapter, verse(s) presented with translation/interpretation and application would also be required.

Therefore, let us begin anew.

How can one define (describe) God in both personal and spiritually meaningful terms that demonstrate a comprehensive understanding of God’s true nature and His relationship to His creation?

[mizpeh]

1)I know God on a personal level because He is in me.

2)I know Him personally because of what He has done in my life.

3)I also know of Him, what He likes and dislikes, His attributes through His word.

4)I can see His "fingerprints" in creation.

5)I know Him because Christ, His Son, makes Him known.

There's much more I could say, but I'm not sure what you want. So why don't you start us off by answering your own question and define God.

[staysharp]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

Recently I came across a question that gave me pause to think. How can one love that which is unknowable? In this case, we are commanded by God to, “… love the LORD thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.” De 6:5, JPS, while at the same time we are informed that God is unknowable and unapproachable. That we are unable to comprehend who or what God truly is, or to understand even His ways.

The Old Testament is full of descriptions of God and explanations (examples) of His nature, while also informing us that God is nothing like what He has revealed to us in His word. That is, God is above and beyond what we can conceive or imagine. All the while, we are expected to both know and to love God – which implies an intimate relationship. How can one establish and maintain such a relationship with someone you can only “know about”, but never actually come to “know” face to face?

This question, of necessity, drives us into a more fundamental dilemma, i.e. how can we describe (even talk about) God intelligently, without committing heresy? Heresy, in this case, being defined by Rabbi Yanki Tauber as “The placement of God within the scale of our reality, the attribution to Him of qualities that are part of our vision of our world and ourselves.”

We are all guilty of making absolute statements about subjects we know next to nothing about. Many times we are willing to die for our convictions - or even to kill others over theirs, as Christians were doing to each other up to only a few hundred years ago.

I therefore place before this assembly the following question:

How can one define (describe) God in both personal and spiritually meaningful terms that demonstrate a comprehensive understanding of God’s true nature and His relationship to His creation?

Okay kids - lets give it a shot. BTW, answeres like , "You can't", or "It is impossible", are not acceptable.

Well, according to scriptures the ancients did have an intimate relationship with God. Adam communed with God, Enoch walked with God, Noah obeyed God, Abraham believed God, David sought the heart of God, etc. Even before Christ was revealed, God was known intimately to those who He chose to reveal himself to. Albeit, a select few.

When Eli chastised his sons for their wickedness, he said something interesting...he said...1 Sam. 2:5 If a man sins against another man, God may mediate for him; but if a man sins against the LORD, who will intercede for him?"

This was God's cry to Israel through Ezekiel..."And I sought for a man among them, that should make up the hedge, and stand in the gap before me for the land, that I should not destroy it: but I found none."

That "man" was to be Christ, the intercessor, the hight priest. However, he had not yet been given to humanity and because Christ was "unknown" death reigned supreme and judgment was swift. Yet, Eli sons did not know God, they were children of Beliel.

Having said that, all we know about God can be found in Christ; for in him dwelt all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.

When Jesus said..."if you've seen me you have seen the father", he was revealing God through him. God is nothing apart from Christ Jesus.

Therefore, because we have been given Christ, we can know God. A personal intimate relationship with the lover of our souls. Sadly, too many Christians view God separate from Christ. They embrace the God of the Old and refuse to embrace Christ of the new. However, God is nothing without Christ and Christ is nothing without God.

In Oneness minded churches, the mantra is "Jesus is God", and while their is truth in that statement, the truth is missed through the denial of God's son.

The teaching of God's son is absent in many of these environments and subsequently individuals are forced into a relationship with God absent of Jesus the Christ which leads to a performance based relationship.

We can know God through Jesus Christ. All God was and is can be found in Christ. By developing a relationship with Jesus, we develop a relationship with the God..."Elohim" Maranatha!!!