Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila
Yes, a good friend of mine that I once worked with named Dave. He repented of his sins but didn't want the Holy Ghost because he was taught that speaking in tongues was of the devil. He also didn't want Jesus name baptism because he believed his previous baptism at his grand daddy's baptist church was just as valid.
The man was bound by false doctrine and couldn't break free....though in Bible study after Bible study he'd agree that the Bible said what it said.
Wow, so I guess Grace can't cover ignorance. To bad your friend was just too dumb to get saved.
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
Quote:
Originally Posted by deltaguitar
Have you ever met anyone who repented of their sins that didn't want the Holy Spirit or Water Baptism. These are easy works to follow. I mean, why not pick some hard ones like loving your brother as yourself.
Repentance some times is not an easy work for some.Did you say work ? Oh well,some people are devil possessed and need devils cast out.Repent means to stop sinning.
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea
From another thread:
Sniff ... sniff ... sniff ...
FALSE DOCTRINE ALERT!!!!
Do you agree w/ Mizpeh in her new-fangled 3 step doctrine that our sins are not forgiven at repentance?
I can't speak for Mizpeh, but is it possible that she actually is implying that sins are not REMITTED or WASHED AWAY at repentance? Wether one agreed with that or not it would not be the same as saying they were not forgiven.
The analogy that is so simple to grasp (again agree with it or not, it is NOT NONSENSICAL) is that of a child who comes in filthy and the parent scolds the child! I TOLD you not to get dirty! And the child cries and says "I'm sorry please forgive me!" where upon the parent DOES. however Forgiven is not WASHED and that is the analogy I have heard and lend much credence to on a SCRIPTURAL basis in the matter called SALVATION.
Paul in Acts 22 clearly tells us that AFTER his experience on the road to Damascus, AFTER he had met the risen Christ, he was instructed AFTER that to arise and be baptized and WASH AWAY HIS SINS.....
So to many many brethren there does indeed appear to be a WASHING AWAY process in water baptism AFTER coming to Christ.
Maybe Miszpeh is referring to that ... I don't know, but the rush to attack rather than clarify is getting kind of interesting all in its own right.
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
I'll post this to the general readers....
I want you to answer this one question by stating one word.... either "Jesus" or "Man"....
Is the command to water baptize, and be water baptized, from Jesus or man?
(Matthew 28:19 KJV)
(19) Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
(Mark 16:16-17 KJV)
(16) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (17) And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
(John 3:5 KJV)
(5) Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
Quote:
- Water Baptism.) Theologically speaking, then, forgiveness and remission are equivalent terms, and forgiveness (or remission) comes with the combination of repentance and water baptism. We should not separate the two experiences.
For purposes of study only, perhaps we can make the following distinction: at repentance, God destroys sin's present dominion in a person's life, and He removes the barrier preventing a personal relationship with Him. At water baptism, God removes the legal record of sin and erases the penalty for that sin, namely death. God deals with the present consequences of sin at repentance and with the future consequences of sin at water baptism. Both are necessary for forgiveness
quoted from the David Bernard
I agree with DB that you will not have forgiveness of sins in baptism without first having faith in Christ and repentance.
I would also agree with DB's statement "God destroys sin's present dominion in a person's life, and He removes the barrier preventing a personal relationship with Him".
I believe there is more than just "God removes the legal record of sin and erases the penalty for that sin, namely death." and " God deals.....with the future consequences of sin at water baptism" when we are baptized in Jesus name. There is a circumcision made by the Spirit at baptism. It is a literal removing of the body of sins from our hearts by the application of the blood of Christ or in other Biblical terms, a washing, a blotting out, which constitutes divine forgiveness.
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His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
Peter's Pentecostal message included two responses to the gospel message; repentance and baptism. The promise of Holy Ghost infilling followed obedience to these commands.
One cannot be Pentecostal without the proper emphasis on these things.
Re: New Doctrine Emerges: NOT Forgiven at Repentan
For salvation Paul was a three stepper and more for salvation.Paul preached the same gospel as the other apostles for salvation.Just worded a little different.
You must be baptized.
Blood was shed at death.Rom.6:: Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death (blood): that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5: For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death (blood), we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection
You must repent.
2 Cor.7:[10] For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Cor.12
[21] And lest, when I come again, my God will humble me among you, and that I shall bewail many which have sinned already, and have not repented of the uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness which they have committed.
You must be filled with the Spirit.
Rom.8
[1] There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
[2] For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.[4] That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
[5] For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
[6] For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
[9] But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
[10] And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
[11] But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
[13] For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
[14] For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
[15] For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
[16] The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
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My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. 
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