Do people know we are here

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I think we're loosing the battle as we focus on mass evangelism. Sure, mass evangelism has it's place. However, we must realize that we're sent one by one into our own everyday routine with the commission to share the gospel. I've had more success with one on one individual evangelism than mass efforts to reach large groups of people. 85% of those who come to church come with a friend or relative. Out of that number the majority who state establish friendships and deep relationships within the body. We need to get out and befriend people, form relationships, bonds, similar interests, etc. Also we have to be sensitive to the Spirit. God's Spirit hasn't chosen the entire community. Out of the majority that are called only a few are chosen. We have to be sensitive enough to tell when we are dealing with a soul that the Lord is drawing so that we can nurture them to salvation. Winning the lost isn't like spraying machine gun fire into large crowds...it's more like being a sniper. It takes time, preparation, patience, and focus. At least, that's my experience.

Amen!

We were at one time trying to get in touch with Matt Maddix to get a SWBC hosted at our church. After repeatedly trying to contact him, leaving message after message, receiving no response or return call, it became evident that this was not the path Jesus wanted us to take. We were dazzled by the numbers - they hype and the sensational news of hundreds being baptized in Jesus' Name and receiving the Holy Ghost baptism in a single weekend. But then you get down to reality, though, and have to sit back and wonder how many of them actually made the leap into a real walk with God and fellowship with their brothers and sisters.

I'm not trying to be antagonistic to Bro. Maddix or any of the others associated with SWBC. They are great men and are doing a wonderful work. I believe, though, that the church needs to do a better job of getting to where these people are and ministering to them where they are. Just because people have a powerful initial experience one weekend does not automatically transfer to an understanding of what has happened to them, in them, nor by extension a real relationship with God and His church. This is where we need to step out of our comfortable, institutional churchianity paradigms and start ministering to people one-to-one. Mass evangelism might stir up some excitement and hype, but afterward, when everyone thinks it's all done, is when we really need to do the hard work... the self-sacrificing work... the loving and feeding and clothing and ministering... THE SERVING.

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

I agree. But are we just paying lip service to the almighty organizations that we are a part of by saying we want to win the lost? Having a desire to win the lost does not always equal the lost acutally being saved, does it? Are we more focused on winning the lost to our church more than winning them to God? I am speaking to myself as well.

I think it has to be very personal. Sure we can get people to come to church, but how we live will help influence more.

[Jack Shephard]

Are we scared to actually reach out cause it will make us be associated with the lowest of the low? It is not like we are that poor in our churches. Pastor and Co-Pastors might need to think about a pay cut inorder to do effective outreach. We that are not in those offices is there anything we can do to make our names be known out there? Not out of egos or pride, but out of a heart that burns for God's people?

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by Margies3

My experience from years of walking with the Lord is that the general public is usually much better acquainted with where "mainline churches" (Catholic, Methodist, Lutheran, etc) are located than with where they can find Apostolic churches.

One really good reason for that is that the mainline churches spend alot of time and energy and money ministering to the needs of others. Physical needs, financial needs, etc. They're reaching people on the level where they live.

That draws in 2 kinds of people: First it draws in those who have the needs. And Second it draws in those who want to help. I see this all the time. People really do want to help their fellow human beings. If you can get them into a church by asking them to get involved with helping out a needy family for Christmas, then chances are fair to middlin that they will stay after the project is over. It's not a guarantee. But I know I've seen a large number of people who've been "hooked" that way.

The other way to get people involved (I've seen this in one of the area mega-churches) is to offer support groups for every little thing - grief counseling, leaving the gay life-style, divorce groups, parents of teenagers, on and on. Again, some will come because they need the group. Others will come because they'll want to become part of the leadership of a group.

Sister, I find this to be true as well. It's the older denominations that we would refer to as "dead" churches that are really doing what Jesus called us to do. Their doctrine is dead, but their works are alive. We are just the opposite, it seems.

You make very valid points! God bless you, sister!

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by cneasttx

I think it has to be very personal. Sure we can get people to come to church, but how we live will help influence more.

Is all that we try to do is get people to our churches or get them to our God by way of our churches?

[Margies3]

Originally Posted by jaamez

Amen!

. Just because people have a powerful initial experience one weekend does not automatically transfer to an understanding of what has happened to them, in them, nor by extension a real relationship with God and His church. This is where we need to step out of our comfortable, institutional churchianity paradigms and start ministering to people one-to-one. Mass evangelism might stir up some excitement and hype, but afterward, when everyone thinks it's all done, is when we really need to do the hard work... the self-sacrificing work... the loving and feeding and clothing and ministering... THE SERVING.

The really scary thing about these mass evangelism experiences is that so many people (even in some churches!) seriously believe that if they or their loved one has ever walked down an aisle and prayed to ask God to forgive their sins, that they have forever sealed their place in Heaven!

You right. We need to start ministering to people one-on-one. Too often, they "get saved" and then get forgotten about. And out they go. That is not saved. Might have been a moving experience, but it's a far cry from a saving experience.

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by cneasttx

I think it has to be very personal. Sure we can get people to come to church, but how we live will help influence more.

It should NEVER be about getting THEM to come TO CHURCH. We are THE CHURCH, and we are called to go TO THEM.

Programs and personalities in our congregations are not going to get it done. The first century church was a living organism that had a tremendous impact on their world because they were IN THEIR WORLD - out there influencing their contemporaries, not shut up in a building three or four times a week. They had power and demonstration. We have concerts and pageants.

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by jaamez

Amen!

We were at one time trying to get in touch with Matt Maddix to get a SWBC hosted at our church. After repeatedly trying to contact him, leaving message after message, receiving no response or return call, it became evident that this was not the path Jesus wanted us to take. We were dazzled by the numbers - they hype and the sensational news of hundreds being baptized in Jesus' Name and receiving the Holy Ghost baptism in a single weekend. But then you get down to reality, though, and have to sit back and wonder how many of them actually made the leap into a real walk with God and fellowship with their brothers and sisters.

I'm not trying to be antagonistic to Bro. Maddix or any of the others associated with SWBC. They are great men and are doing a wonderful work. I believe, though, that the church needs to do a better job of getting to where these people are and ministering to them where they are. Just because people have a powerful initial experience one weekend does not automatically transfer to an understanding of what has happened to them, in them, nor by extension a real relationship with God and His church. This is where we need to step out of our comfortable, institutional churchianity paradigms and start ministering to people one-to-one. Mass evangelism might stir up some excitement and hype, but afterward, when everyone thinks it's all done, is when we really need to do the hard work... the self-sacrificing work... the loving and feeding and clothing and ministering... THE SERVING.

You said a lot of good here. Mass evangelism comes in all shapes and sizes. SWBC's are great, but you are right it is work afterwards. Is that work too much for us to do? Again I am trying to challenge myself too.

I am affraid 1 of 2 things are happening. First we bring people in and they have a great experience with God and we don't follow up and they are never seen again. Second, we do all the "reaching the lost" instead of pointing them to God we point them to a system or an assembly only and leave God out of it, IMO

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by Margies3

The really scary thing about these mass evangelism experiences is that so many people (even in some churches!) seriously believe that if they or their loved one has ever walked down an aisle and prayed to ask God to forgive their sins, that they have forever sealed their place in Heaven!

You right. We need to start ministering to people one-on-one. Too often, they "get saved" and then get forgotten about. And out they go. That is not saved. Might have been a moving experience, but it's a far cry from a saving experience.

Isn't the churches job to grow them up after we get them in? Mass evangelism is not and end all to reaching the lost. I would dare say more people are won to God one on one than in mass evagelism, but if you were to reach 200 people in mass evangelism and 10 stayed that is great, but if you had 100 people do individual evangelism and 20 stayed are the first 10 discounted? No way, but we the church must use everything we have to reach out shouldn't we? Will we be allowed excuses at the judgement? I am not trying to sound holy it has been years since I won a sould but no matter what the church seems to be falling behind in keeping them in. The back door is wider than the front.

[Withdrawn]

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

Isn't the churches job to grow them up after we get them in? Mass evangelism is not and end all to reaching the lost. I would dare say more people are won to God one on one than in mass evagelism, but if you were to reach 200 people in mass evangelism and 10 stayed that is great, but if you had 100 people do individual evangelism and 20 stayed are the first 10 discounted? No way, but we the church must use everything we have to reach out shouldn't we? Will we be allowed excuses at the judgement? I am not trying to sound holy it has been years since I won a sould but no matter what the church seems to be falling behind in keeping them in. The back door is wider than the front.

This may seem like a broad brush; it is not intended that way. I'm sure that there are many congregations that are "getting it done" and are truly making an impact in their area. But in my experience (24 years attending camp meetings, general conferences, youth conferences, rallies, crusades, etc.) we have preached ourselves into a box. We've preached to the point where our people think it's a sin to be around the very people that need us the most. We've preached to the point where it's a sin to go to some of the places where they live. We've gotten stuck on the "holy and righteous living" platform and have become a one trick pony to the point where we are completely out of touch with what this world needs. This world does not need to know how to dress. They need to know how to get in touch with their Creator and Savior and enter into reconciliation with Him. Don't get me wrong, we need to preach against sin. But we need to tell them how to escape its grip and find power to overcome.

I can't tell you how many retreats and conferences I've attended over the last five or ten years. I understand that they are really intended for the saints, but instead of the constant preaching about standards and separation, how 'bout some convicting messages about evangelizing a fallen world? Instead of sending the saints home shouting about how great God is or how holy we are or how blessed we are to be in the church, send us home convicted and burdened by the fact that we have not lived up to our primary objective, with changed hearts to seek the face of God on how He would have us work in our communities.

Luke 4.18-19 (NIV)
"The Spirit of the Lord is on me,
because he has anointed me
to preach good news to the poor.
He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners
and recovery of sight for the blind,
to release the oppressed,
to proclaim the year of the Lord's favor."

Funny, He doesn't mention standards (or even Acts 2.38).