Obey Them that Rule???

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

"Wrong" can be a mighty subjective term.

If he is telling them to do something sinful or unscriptural, ILG has a point.

But much of the time the pastor knows things about situations that others who like to second guess and play arm chair quarterback don't know. Thus, they think the advice is wrong when they are uninformed.

If your assessment of "wrong" is just personal disagreement based on opinion and not Scriptural grounds, then you need to do as Miss B has stated, because you are not the one given the oversight of the flock. that is the pastor.

It is funny how it happens in the church, you disagree with someone, or say something they disagree with (absence of any malice, ill-intent, or bad attitudes) and it never fails, your relationship takes a direct hit and sometimes it can be fatal.

This is the absolute worst and most damning dynamic in Pentecost if you ask me.

[StillStanding]

On that great judgment day, will God accept the excuse that pastor so and so told me to do it his/her way, and I just submitted myself to him/her?

I don't think so!

We all are accountable for ourselves on judgment day, so I believe we all have a right to weigh what is being taught against scripture, and then determine if we will submit to that teaching.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by mfblume

When a preacher preaches the Word, it is not really the preacher that we are attending our ears to. It is God's Word. That makes nothing more of the man than a man. But we give highest regard if it was a 12 year old reading the Word to us, for a preacher is an ambassador for the Lord reprsenting Him. Some take that too far and get into what Michlow has indicated, where they order everyone's every breath. And some people want it that way since that is easier than getting to know the Lord personally.

The spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet and just because a man preaches something doesn't mean he has God's ear.

Blessings, Rhoni

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Pianoman

On that great judgment day, will God accept the excuse that pastor so and so told me to do it his/her way, and I just submitted myself to him/her?

I don't think so!

We all are accountable for ourselves on judgment day, so I believe we all have a right to weigh what is being taught against scripture, and then determine if we will submit to that teaching.

AMEN! I hope you don't get stoned because I agree with you!

Blessings, Rhoni

Originally Posted by ILG

Okay, what if he is teaching that extrabiblical stuff is biblical and it is really harming the person and they are very confused? What do you do then?

This here is where lies the true problem. Do we obey them who add or take from Gods word? I think not!

[ILG]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

AMEN! I hope you don't get stoned because I agree with you!

Blessigns, Rhoni

Stoned? Pianoman wouldn't do that!! Hopefully, he wouldn't snort his Dad either.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by ILG

Okay, what if he is teaching that extrabiblical stuff is biblical and it is really harming the person and they are very confused? What do you do then?

It's hard to make specific statements, because as CS said, some of this is very subjective, BUT at some point there has to be a "deal-breaker", in which I will not subject myself or my family to false doctrine.

That's why we have to search the scriptures ourselves. It's a delicate balance between being accountable to both God and men.

Furthermore, it should be determined whether a man is teaching that which is extrabiblical as biblical as a means of manipulation, OR if he is teaching what is extrabiblical as biblical because that is what he truly believes. The difference is only important, because it points to the character and conscience of the minister...not because the doctrine being taught is really different.

I have known ministers from both categories. However, most of the ministers I know do not teach the extrabiblical as anything more than a matter of obedience. I have rarely met those who teach something as biblical simply as a tool of manipulation. Of those ministers that I know, I can think of only one who I believe to be guilty of such. (a couple of others I suspect, but can't really say for certain.) The rest either sincerely believe what they are teaching to be biblical or they teach it as preference and obedience.

As far as what the person should do...I firmly believe that burying your nose in God's Word and spending a lot of time in prayer and fasting will lift any fog that has surrounded you. When there's confusion, we must seek God, because He is not the author of confusion.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by ILG

Stoned? Pianoman wouldn't do that!! Hopefully, he wouldn't snort his Dad either.

You caught me...poor choice of words! You're quick!

Blessings, Rhoni

[ILG]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

It's hard to make specific statements, because as CS said, some of this is very subjective, BUT at some point there has to be a "deal-breaker", in which I will not subject myself or my family to false doctrine.

That's why we have to search the scriptures ourselves. It's a delicate balance between being accountable to both God and men.

Furthermore, it should be determined whether a man is teaching that which is extrabiblical as biblical as a means of manipulation, OR if he is teaching what is extrabiblical as biblical because that is what he truly believes. The difference is only important, because it points to the character and conscience of the minister...not because the doctrine being taught is really different.

I have known ministers from both categories. However, most of the ministers I know do not teach the extrabiblical as anything more than a matter of obedience. I have rarely met those who teach something as biblical simply as a tool of manipulation. Of those ministers that I know, I can think of only one who I believe to be guilty of such. The rest either sincerely believe what they are teaching to be biblical or they teach it as preference and obedience.

As far as what the person should do...I firmly believe that burying your nose in God's Word and spending a lot of time in prayer and fasting will lift any fog that has surrounded you. When there's confusion, we must seek God, because He is not the author of confusion.

Good answer. But there is a 'deal breaker' for your family. As well, I think there must also be a time when it is a 'deal breaker' in helping out those around you (vs. submission) lest a person end up saying "Am I my brother's keeper?"

[ILG]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

You caught me...poor choice of words! You're quick!

Blessings, Rhoni

I'm either quick or have a warped mind. Let's skip the poll.