Thank you for posting this, FB. I was just sitting here thinking that I don't have a huge problem with people dressing up for church. And I certainly don't have a problem with it if someone dresses casually for church (since that's what we do all the time).
But the one thing I think that we all need to take into consideration is this: are we keeping some people from coming to the Lord at our church because they feel uncomfortable and out of place in our midst since they aren't dressed as finely.
I had an experience a number of years ago that had a big impact on me. I went to the big Apostolic church in our area for a Christmas drama. I went in to use the restroom and there was the wife of one of the top leaders in this church with her little girl, about age 3. The little girl had a gorgeous dress on. Lots of ruffles and lace. Had a real can-can kind of look. Fancy, fancy, fancy!! Someone said to her that they liked the little girl's dress. The mom answered that she had gotten it for a steal - only had to pay $225.00 for it!!
For a BABY's dress!! $225!!!!!!
That just bothered me so much. I know we all waste our share of money on things that really are unimportant. But I kept thinking that that money could have bought groceries for a month for a needy family. Please don't think I'm being horribly judgmental.
That is steep even today. I can't imagine what it was back then.
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
Thank you for posting this, FB. I was just sitting here thinking that I don't have a huge problem with people dressing up for church. And I certainly don't have a problem with it if someone dresses casually for church (since that's what we do all the time).
But the one thing I think that we all need to take into consideration is this: are we keeping some people from coming to the Lord at our church because they feel uncomfortable and out of place in our midst since they aren't dressed as finely.
I had an experience a number of years ago that had a big impact on me. I went to the big Apostolic church in our area for a Christmas drama. I went in to use the restroom and there was the wife of one of the top leaders in this church with her little girl, about age 3. The little girl had a gorgeous dress on. Lots of ruffles and lace. Had a real can-can kind of look. Fancy, fancy, fancy!! Someone said to her that they liked the little girl's dress. The mom answered that she had gotten it for a steal - only had to pay $225.00 for it!!
For a BABY's dress!! $225!!!!!!
That just bothered me so much. I know we all waste our share of money on things that really are unimportant. But I kept thinking that that money could have bought groceries for a month for a needy family. Please don't think I'm being horribly judgmental.
Margie,
That kind of stuff isn't only in the UPC. I think it's ridiculous to pinpoint that to only the UPCI. My sister was going to a Baptist church with all their snobbery too! She and her husband left for a smaller church. LOL!
Thank you for posting this, FB. I was just sitting here thinking that I don't have a huge problem with people dressing up for church. And I certainly don't have a problem with it if someone dresses casually for church (since that's what we do all the time).
But the one thing I think that we all need to take into consideration is this: are we keeping some people from coming to the Lord at our church because they feel uncomfortable and out of place in our midst since they aren't dressed as finely.
I had an experience a number of years ago that had a big impact on me. I went to the big Apostolic church in our area for a Christmas drama. I went in to use the restroom and there was the wife of one of the top leaders in this church with her little girl, about age 3. The little girl had a gorgeous dress on. Lots of ruffles and lace. Had a real can-can kind of look. Fancy, fancy, fancy!! Someone said to her that they liked the little girl's dress. The mom answered that she had gotten it for a steal - only had to pay $225.00 for it!!
For a BABY's dress!! $225!!!!!!
That just bothered me so much. I know we all waste our share of money on things that really are unimportant. But I kept thinking that that money could have bought groceries for a month for a needy family. Please don't think I'm being horribly judgmental.
This is the not so pleasant side of UPC culture, most people can not relate.
Reminds me of the same attitudes those with a little wealth display when they are comparing notes regarding things like schools & homes.
The last two years I've taken my girls to Holiday Youth Convention. Usually we always have other kids from school with us. Two years ago, my daughter's boyfriend interest at that time (my boss' son) went with us. He made the comment that everyone looked like they were going to the prom or something... yep... they do all right.
Then this past December, two girlfriends from school came with us. I got a hotel room downtown. The girls from school got dressed in their nicest clothes and everyone fixed hair better than normal. I thought they all looked nice.
I stood back and watched as those girls became uncomfortable as they watched the fashion show displayed before them. They felt out of place in their more casual clothing (although they did wear nice skirts and tops). They were astonished at elaborate hair styles... clothes that were outrageous even on the guys...they kept making comments about their clothes not being nice enough. It was one of the first times I saw through the eyes of a visitor.... and I was ashamed at what we call religion.
There is nothing worse than putting someone into a situation where they stick out like sore thumbs... We ended up leaving early when after searching for seats and unable to find one... and so tired of standing.
Personally I am so over all the dress clothes stuff...
Teenagers have enough pressure from the world, they sure don't need it from the church. I think that's what happens when it's not about JESUS, it's about people.
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
The last two years I've taken my girls to Holiday Youth Convention. Usually we always have other kids from school with us. Two years ago, my daughter's boyfriend interest at that time (my boss' son) went with us. He made the comment that everyone looked like they were going to the prom or something... yep... they do all right.
Then this past December, two girlfriends from school came with us. I got a hotel room downtown. The girls from school got dressed in their nicest clothes and everyone fixed hair better than normal. I thought they all looked nice.
I stood back and watched as those girls became uncomfortable as they watched the fashion show displayed before them. They felt out of place in their more casual clothing (although they did wear nice skirts and tops). They were astonished at elaborate hair styles... clothes that were outrageous even on the guys...they kept making comments about their clothes not being nice enough. It was one of the first times I saw through the eyes of a visitor.... and I was ashamed at what we call religion.
What does it have to do with religion? I've been to youth conventions and youth congress too, and usually there's a pretty equal mix of dressed up and the casual, funky crowd.
My daughters are free to dress how they want for youth camp and convention--as long as they're neat, modest and appropriate. I would hope that no one would criticize them whether they dress up or down.
Quote:
There is nothing worse than putting someone into a situation where they stick out like sore thumbs... We ended up leaving early when after searching for seats and unable to find one... and so tired of standing.
Personally I am so over all the dress clothes stuff...
I know what you mean by this comment, but in a way, I guess you aren't really "over" it, if other people dressing up bothers you and makes you think less of them somehow.
My daughter has a friend that comes to church with her sometimes--she comes from a terrible home--and usually when she comes over she wants to borrow something from Sarah's closet and fix her hair like the girls. And not because they embarrass her or put her down, but because she is trying to emulate them. Our church is NOT the type of place where casual dressers feel out of place.
To me, it sounds like you were projecting a little. JMO. If girls in my presence had done the same (commenting about their clothes), I would have quickly pointed out that everyone is dressed how they want to dress, and they should be comfortable in their own skin and clothes--and then enjoy the service. Sometimes people feel uncomfortable and it is NOT the fault of others! If a child or teenager draws a poor conclusion, then it should be nipped in the bud by a wiser adult--not catered to or agreed with.
I DO realize that some people wear fancy clothes and have a matching haughty attitude--but A. That's not a "religion" problem--it's a "sinful heart" problem, and B. It's just as unfair to assume there's a matching attitude behind haute couture as it is to assume there's a matching attitude behind casual attire. (e.g., casual attitude and approach to God as opposed to taking Him seriously)
I talk to my girls quite a bit about what to wear for different occasions, what's proper, what isn't, what's classy, what's not--but I also tell them all the time to be comfortable in their own skin.
Sarah, in particular, has a funky, colorful style that is definitely ALL HER OWN. She has been known to walk out of the house in colorful striped tights, brown suede boots, a t-shirt, a denim vest, frilly skirt, a blue corduroy newsboy cap and aqua-blue arm warmers. (Yes, I just described one of her actual outfits!) I don't stop her from having her own style just because I wouldn't be caught dead in ANY of that!!!! She doesn't even match sometimes, but with her personality it just somehow works.
If someone made her feel uncomfortable with their appearance only, I would give her a pep talk about how she's fine just like she is, and tell her that she has no way of knowing what that other person is really thinking or feeling! I certainly wouldn't agree with her that the other person was probably looking down on her, and shame on them for being so terrible as to look down on others by dressing in finery.
The truth is, MOST people are just people, no matter how nice their clothes are. Or how 'not' nice their clothes are.
If someone had actually said or did something rude to your girls, I might be better able to understand your post, but to assume that others have a haughty attitude simply because they are dressed up is silly.
I don't get how the presence of others being dressed up means they're responsible for the discomfort of others. Basically what you're saying is that in order for religion to not be something you are "ashamed" of, a casual rule should be imposed, and everyone who wants to be of the higher spiritual ilk should dress casual so as not to make others uncomfortable.
Personally, I think people should be able to wear whatEVER they want when they go to church, as long as it's neat and modest. Freedom needs to extend to everyone, though. It's just as limiting to tell people they shouldn't dress up as it is to tell people they can't come in casual clothes.
__________________
"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
What does it have to do with religion? I've been to youth conventions and youth congress too, and usually there's a pretty equal mix of dressed up and the casual, funky crowd.
My daughters are free to dress how they want for youth camp and convention--as long as they're neat, modest and appropriate. I would hope that no one would criticize them whether they dress up or down.
I know what you mean by this comment, but in a way, I guess you aren't really "over" it, if other people dressing up bothers you and makes you think less of them somehow.
My daughter has a friend that comes to church with her sometimes--she comes from a terrible home--and usually when she comes over she wants to borrow something from Sarah's closet and fix her hair like the girls. And not because they embarrass her or put her down, but because she is trying to emulate them. Our church is NOT the type of place where casual dressers feel out of place.
To me, it sounds like you were projecting a little. JMO. If girls in my presence had done the same (commenting about their clothes), I would have quickly pointed out that everyone is dressed how they want to dress, and they should be comfortable in their own skin and clothes--and then enjoy the service. Sometimes people feel uncomfortable and it is NOT the fault of others! If a child or teenager draws a poor conclusion, then it should be nipped in the bud by a wiser adult--not catered to or agreed with.
I DO realize that some people wear fancy clothes and have a matching haughty attitude--but A. That's not a "religion" problem--it's a "sinful heart" problem, and B. It's just as unfair to assume there's a matching attitude behind haute couture as it is to assume there's a matching attitude behind casual attire. (e.g., casual attitude and approach to God as opposed to taking Him seriously)
I talk to my girls quite a bit about what to wear for different occasions, what's proper, what isn't, what's classy, what's not--but I also tell them all the time to be comfortable in their own skin.
Sarah, in particular, has a funky, colorful style that is definitely ALL HER OWN. She has been known to walk out of the house in colorful striped tights, brown suede boots, a t-shirt, a denim vest, frilly skirt, a blue corduroy newsboy cap and aqua-blue arm warmers. (Yes, I just described one of her actual outfits!) I don't stop her from having her own style just because I wouldn't be caught dead in ANY of that!!!! She doesn't even match sometimes, but with her personality it just somehow works.
If someone made her feel uncomfortable with their appearance only, I would give her a pep talk about how she's fine just like she is, and tell her that she has no way of knowing what that other person is really thinking or feeling! I certainly wouldn't agree with her that the other person was probably looking down on her, and shame on them for being so terrible as to look down on others by dressing in finery.
The truth is, MOST people are just people, no matter how nice their clothes are. Or how 'not' nice their clothes are.
If someone had actually said or did something rude to your girls, I might be better able to understand your post, but to assume that others have a haughty attitude simply because they are dressed up is silly.
I don't get how the presence of others being dressed up means they're responsible for the discomfort of others. Basically what you're saying is that in order for religion to not be something you are "ashamed" of, a casual rule should be imposed, and everyone who wants to be of the higher spiritual ilk should dress casual so as not to make others uncomfortable.
Personally, I think people should be able to wear whatEVER they want when they go to church, as long as it's neat and modest. Freedom needs to extend to everyone, though. It's just as limiting to tell people they shouldn't dress up as it is to tell people they can't come in casual clothes.
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
I always dress nicely for church. A nice Hawaiian shirt, nice cargo shorts or pants, nice sandals.
I always wear my best pair of jeans with my nicest pair of running shoes!
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You become free from who you have become, by becoming who you were meant to be. ~Mark from another forum I post on
God did it for us. Out of sheer generosity he put us in right standing with himself. A pure gift. He got us out of the mess we're in and restored us to where he always wanted us to be. And he did it by means of Jesus Christ. ~Romans 3:24 from The Message
I don't stop her from having her own style just because I wouldn't be caught dead in ANY of that!!!! She doesn't even match sometimes, but with her personality it just somehow works. 
Hybrid Mode
