I know that there are plenty of possible scenarios and I do look forward to finding out more. I'm just saying that if he did indeed demosntrate that he was the homeowner, I don't see why he would be arrested even if he wasn't polite.
Given the nature of the call, I don't see how the police would even approach it as a hard and fast "crime in progress" call. Now if the alarm was going off, that's a different story. If someone was saying "somebody is breaking into my house, that's a different story. If someone was saying "I know the homeowner and this is definitely not the homeowner", that's a different story. At the most, all that was justified here was a knock on the door and a courtesy check. I don't see why the cops were even in the house to begin with.
As far as disorderly conduct, I think the key phrase is "behaving in a disruptive manner". There is nothing to indicate that he was behaving in a disruptive manner before the officers arrived, and nothing to suggest that he would be a threat to anyone after they left.
Unless he physically accosted them, I think cooler heads should have apologized and defused the situation.
Let me preview this by saying I have been away for a few days. Haven't read the whole thread - and haven't been updated by the media regarding this situation.... However, while reading through this thread, the above comment just grabbed me and I couldn't resist responding before finishing my read.... I apologize if this has already been discussed......
Stew - you are cracking me up here! Obviously, you have never had someone you love take an oath to protect their city - put their life on the line every single day to fulfill that oath!
1) Night
2) Neighbor call someone breaking in
3) Yeah, right - we just calmly walk up to the door, knock and give a "courtesy call" to verify identity......
Officer: "Sir, we received a call that someone was breaking in here. Do you live here?" Possible criminal: "Oh, yes I certainly do!
Officer: "Thank you kind sir. Sorry to have bothered you."
You think criminals always tell the truth????
Until someone you love dearly is the one putting their life on the line each and every day - you cannot understand what these men and women go through! Is there sometimes police abuse of power? Absolutely - however, from my knowledge of this situation, it appears that this officer has an impeccable record. When I catch up on the past three days news and if I find out differently, I will be back to apologize.
My problem with all this.............. All the professor had to do was present his ID (calmly and politely) when FIRST asked for it!!! Had this been me, I would have felt bad that I had caused the officers to be taken off the street to check out my situation - simply because I had "stupidly" locked myself out of my home.
Also......... as an aside, we were never allowed to use the word stupid or any derivative of it in our home. It went against my grain to type it in the above paragraph. For the POTUS to have described the Cambridge police department's actions as such overrode my mother's voice! He is a man totally without class to have used his position and spoken in such a manner!
__________________ For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the LORD, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope. Jeremiah 29:11
Monkeyman, my friend, I am disappointed in your posting. Yes, I know that there is some racial profiling BUT - ....... it would appear to me that your case of "racial profiling" had something to do with terrorist activity. IMHO, after what happened on 9/11, I believe there is a little racial profiling that is acceptable in terrorist suspicions.
I am very well acquainted with three young men who were yanked from their car at gun point very early in the morning - simply because their car matched the description of a car being used in drive-by shootings. And these young men were WHITE !!!! I also know a WHITE young man who was very tanned from working outside and had dark hair, a beard stubble who was "racially profiled" at an airport and forced to open his carry-on baggage in front of everyone in line PRIOR to it going through the x-ray screener. Personally, I was glad! I had someone I loved getting on that plane and I was thankful that they were being that careful!
I'm outta here....................
__________________ For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the LORD, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope. Jeremiah 29:11
Let me preview this by saying I have been away for a few days. Haven't read the whole thread - and haven't been updated by the media regarding this situation.... However, while reading through this thread, the above comment just grabbed me and I couldn't resist responding before finishing my read.... I apologize if this has already been discussed......
Stew - you are cracking me up here! Obviously, you have never had someone you love take an oath to protect their city - put their life on the line every single day to fulfill that oath!
1) Night
2) Neighbor call someone breaking in
3) Yeah, right - we just calmly walk up to the door, knock and give a "courtesy call" to verify identity......
Officer: "Sir, we received a call that someone was breaking in here. Do you live here?" Possible criminal: "Oh, yes I certainly do!
Officer: "Thank you kind sir. Sorry to have bothered you."
You think criminals always tell the truth????
Until someone you love dearly is the one putting their life on the line each and every day - you cannot understand what these men and women go through! Is there sometimes police abuse of power? Absolutely - however, from my knowledge of this situation, it appears that this officer has an impeccable record. When I catch up on the past three days news and if I find out differently, I will be back to apologize.
My problem with all this.............. All the professor had to do was present his ID (calmly and politely) when FIRST asked for it!!! Had this been me, I would have felt bad that I had caused the officers to be taken off the street to check out my situation - simply because I had "stupidly" locked myself out of my home.
Also......... as an aside, we were never allowed to use the word stupid or any derivative of it in our home. It went against my grain to type it in the above paragraph. For the POTUS to have described the Cambridge police department's actions as such overrode my mother's voice! He is a man totally without class to have used his position and spoken in such a manner!
Sweet Pea,
You bring up a good point about what was taught in your home. In this situation with Obama's remarks concerning the Cambridge police department it takes it to another level. Not only using the word "stupidly" BUT the larger issue of undermining the respect for authority figures in our lives. Every punk kid or gangsta wannabe will hone in on that. We see that in the poles that say the black community were pleased with Obama's remarks by over 70%!
He, IMO, has put all of our police officers in harms way by setting a precedent that we don't have to respect them! He also showed his true character by speaking out before knowing the facts. He is doing the same thing by pushing reform that is not studied out, bills that are not read, etc., etc., etc.
He totally crossed the line denouncing the medical profession by saying that doctors will perform unnecessary operations to make more money! Lumping them all together into one pot!
I believe my view of his arrogance has not changed and has only been enhanced by his actions of late. I'm more disappointed in his leadership than I have ever been. He is not good for this country.
Let me preview this by saying I have been away for a few days. Haven't read the whole thread - and haven't been updated by the media regarding this situation.... However, while reading through this thread, the above comment just grabbed me and I couldn't resist responding before finishing my read.... I apologize if this has already been discussed......
Stew - you are cracking me up here! Obviously, you have never had someone you love take an oath to protect their city - put their life on the line every single day to fulfill that oath!
1) Night
2) Neighbor call someone breaking in
3) Yeah, right - we just calmly walk up to the door, knock and give a "courtesy call" to verify identity......
Officer: "Sir, we received a call that someone was breaking in here. Do you live here?" Possible criminal: "Oh, yes I certainly do!
Officer: "Thank you kind sir. Sorry to have bothered you."
You think criminals always tell the truth????
Until someone you love dearly is the one putting their life on the line each and every day - you cannot understand what these men and women go through! Is there sometimes police abuse of power? Absolutely - however, from my knowledge of this situation, it appears that this officer has an impeccable record. When I catch up on the past three days news and if I find out differently, I will be back to apologize.
My problem with all this.............. All the professor had to do was present his ID (calmly and politely) when FIRST asked for it!!! Had this been me, I would have felt bad that I had caused the officers to be taken off the street to check out my situation - simply because I had "stupidly" locked myself out of my home.
Also......... as an aside, we were never allowed to use the word stupid or any derivative of it in our home. It went against my grain to type it in the above paragraph. For the POTUS to have described the Cambridge police department's actions as such overrode my mother's voice! He is a man totally without class to have used his position and spoken in such a manner!
Sweet Pea, I actually do have many people close to me in law enforcement. I have brothers in my church as well who I know to be great officers. I do not for a second, though, take that as proof that every officer is good and right in how he or she approaches every situation.
I think that to try to infer that questioning one officer is somehow indicative of someone having no respect for any officer is unhealthy in a conversation like this. It's the old "you must not be a patriot if you question the decisions of the Commander-in-Chief" argument all over again.
a.) It was not night
b.) the point that many people are making is that upon arriving and seeing a well-dressed sixty year old man in the foyer, most people would have recognized that it was possibly not a break-in. Where people interject race into the conversation is when discussing whether the way the officer and the caller approached the situation may have been different. I do not presume to know this, but I will say that if did affect the way he was approached, it would not be the first time it happened.
I have also never intimated that I think the professor acted appropriately. I was not there and do not have an objective account of the events...but I am pretty confident that the professor was irate and loud.
You said "You think criminals always tell the truth???? "
Many say "Do you think the officer involved always tells the truth?"
Now obviously the officers are truthful more often than criminals...but at the same time, not everyone who has contact with the police is a "criminal"
I'm not one to assume that a police report is an unbiased, accurate description of events (I know officers who know how to word reports just right. It would be pretty foolish in my opinion for an officer to write a report that indicated wrongdoing on his part)
"While I was led to believe that Gates was lawfully in the residence, I was quite surprised and confused at the behavior he exhibited towards me.I asked Gates to provide me with photo identification so that I could verify that he resided at ______ and so that I could radio my findings to ECC. Gates initially refused, demanding that I show him identification, but then he did supply me with a Harvard University identification card. Upon learning that Gates was affiliated with Harvard, I radioed and requested the presence of the Harvard University Police"
The simple question that many people are asking is why after Gates had provided ID, was the officer continuing to remain in the house...and in fact call for backup?
Once they found out it was Gate’s house, they should have left immediately, yelling or not. Cops aren’t special humans who can’t be yelled at...particularly when they are mistaken and you have complied with their orders sufficiently in your own house.
I have never once attempted to defend Obama's or Gate's actions. My question has been about whether he should have been arrested at his house...and how much of the story might not be reflected in either the police report or Gates' account. The truth may lie somewhere in the middle.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
... I have never once attempted to defend Obama's or Gate's actions. My question has been about whether he should have been arrested at his house...and how much of the story might not be reflected in either the police report or Gates' account. The truth may lie somewhere in the middle.
Stewie, I understood that he was arrested for disorderly conduct. This charge and arrest was the result of action after the initial contact and ID check.
Basically, he ticked the cops off. He kept after them. Even the African-American cop who was photographed at the scene said he was "100%" in support of the arrest.
Cops do have the discretion to arrest and/or hold someone who is being "disruptive." The photo of the scene seems to show the prof was at least being loud. But once the arrest is made, the local DA has the discretion to throw the whole thing out - and that's what happened.
If we agree that the cops were within their rights to question and ask for ID - and I think we are, then the whole case is moot - except that the prof didn't want to leave it at that. Perhaps he felt offended and belittled by the circumstance? Dunno. But he pushed back at the cops and triggered his own arrest. And even then, his "push back" was considered of such an inconsequential nature that the DA threw the whole thing out. So, it's hard to say the prof was the "bad guy" either.
It was just some local thing where cooler heads needed to prevail. It never should have involved the President of the United States.
the man was wearing a backpack...how well dressed, well to do man we are not told, but he was wearing a backpack
He was seen by a neighbor PRYING the front door open.
The house was RECENTLY burglarized
The Cops were only told it was a break in. They were not told it was being broken into by the owner.
think about it. They have to do an investigation and ASSUME there might have been a break in IN PROGRESS...if that is the case they can't NOT be cautious. It could mean their life.
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
the man was wearing a backpack...how well dressed, well to do man we are not told, but he was wearing a backpack
He was seen by a neighbor PRYING the front door open.
The house was RECENTLY burglarized
The Cops were only told it was a break in. They were not told it was being broken into by the owner.
think about it. They have to do an investigation and ASSUME there might have been a break in IN PROGRESS...if that is the case they can't NOT be cautious. It could mean their life.
Don't try to confuse us with the facts and logic. Thank heavens Monkeyman should be along anytime to straighten you out by claiming that you are just prejudice and this was a terrible civil rights injustice against this dear Black college professor.
Oh, and did you know Black folks can't get jobs in America? That they have no preferential treatment? Just ask Monkeyman. Speaking of which do you know what the ideal employment canidate is for many American Corporations? It is a handicapped black lesbian female. That is the homerun in diversity.
__________________ "I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
There's an old skit, humorous, black folk put on the make-up and live white, some of you white folk should do the opposite and get the surprise of your life...well, there goes my AFF career, I done called you out, Internet suicide, at least I was man enough to say it. You all act like Gates overacted, maybe he did, but you don't know ANYTHING about the straw upon straw, that broke this camels back, not a single one of you!!!!!
Written from my iPhone, sorry about mistakes, after these posts, I won't be popular around here do I don't think it will matter much, lol.
Monk,
I've avoided this post. I'll admit it. I get WAY too emotional on this stuff. I'll admit that I haven't read every post because when people start in on....stuff...I can't handle it. But Monk, I read yours and I just want to stand and applaud. This stuff makes me cry and I'm crying right now.
As far as I'm concerned, the only person that has ANY street-cred for this subject is Tstew. EVERY SINGLE word he says should be listened to.
Until ANY of you have walked through a mall with dark skin, you SHOULD LISTEN RATHER THAN TALK.
Go read the book "Black Like Me" by John Howard Griffin.
__________________ Who dares accuse us whom God has chosen for his own? Will God? No! HE IS THE ONE who has given us right standing with himself. Who then will condemn us? Will Christ Jesus? No, for HE IS THE ONE who died for us and was raised to life for us and is sitting at the place of highest honor next to God, pleading for us. (Romans 8:33-34)
"The greatest enemy to the movement of Jesus Christ is Christianity". –Erwin McManus
I did see where someone said that racism is mostly gone. I don't remember who said it and don't care, but....you are living in a freaking dreamworld.
Within the last 5 years a major university in the midwest sent out 10,000 resumes to Fortune 500 companies. Half of them had typical "white" names and half of them had typical African-American names.
The white applications were:
EIGHT TIMES MORE LIKELY TO GET CALLED FOR AN INTERVIEW!!!!!
Put that in your "head-stuck-in-the-sand" pipe and smoke it.
__________________ Who dares accuse us whom God has chosen for his own? Will God? No! HE IS THE ONE who has given us right standing with himself. Who then will condemn us? Will Christ Jesus? No, for HE IS THE ONE who died for us and was raised to life for us and is sitting at the place of highest honor next to God, pleading for us. (Romans 8:33-34)
"The greatest enemy to the movement of Jesus Christ is Christianity". –Erwin McManus
it would appear to me that your case of "racial profiling" had something to do with terrorist activity. IMHO, after what happened on 9/11, I believe there is a little racial profiling that is acceptable in terrorist suspicions. 
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