Personally, I think the issue is tied VERY strongly to the issue of authority and headship. I do not believe it is proper for a woman to exercise the authority of office over men. Therefore I cannot accept the idea of a woman Pastor/Apostle. However, a preacher is not necessarily in authority. Most often, they are simply delivering an expository or allegorical message from the word. I preach very often, but I understand that under current church hierarchy...I have no authority. The peopel are not bound to obey anyone but the Pastor (no...I do not agree with this foolish idea, but thats the church world we live in).
In the end, I may be wrong and women preaching may be equally incorrect as Pastoring. However, I have not ever felt anything check my spirit on my opinion of them preaching. Thats not to say I go out of my way to listen to them. Personally, I've never heard a great one. I've heard some emotional ones. I've heard some that can appeal more effectively to the women in a church, but I have yet to hear any that I am "blown away" by so I don't pay much mind to them.
How many women have you actually heard preach? And how many of them have you heard preach more than 3 times?
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I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
Shirley Carson years ago. Heard Sis McGruder speak a couple times. I heard one of the Manguns. I have seen a few of the TV women more than 3 times and they made me want to throw things at them everytime.
Honestly, I do not see how in the world you cannot see that the "Because" of God's judgements on the Jerusalem women was their pride & showiness as revealed in their ornamentation [that God takes the time to enumerate, hmmm]. "Therefore" [for THIS REASON] God sends His judgements.
I don't see how in the world you cannot see this [do not mean to sound so abrasive, haven't had my coffee yet!]. The definitions that you posted is PRECISELY what I knew it would say............out of pocket for a few days.
I'm amazed that you cannot see that I must be right. It is plain and simple. But, I will give you an easy way to show me I am wrong. Give me one example of therefore ever being used as you are saying it can and you will have shown your position possible. It's not hard, we don't even need to argue about whose interpretation of that verse is right or wrong. Just an example is all I need to see.
Because my step son refused to eat his dinner and was giving me attitude therefore he will be going to bed early which he hates more than just about anything.
Is that pretty similar to what you were looking for?
It sounds accurrate to say that Because the women of Zion were haughty and dressed up in jewelry an dtinkling feet, therefore God punished them. Just like Isaiah said. Then he said that because they were haughty He would take all their shiny toys and leave them with just a stink.
Are you trying to say God didn't punish them because they were haughty and wearing jewelry?
Because my step son refused to eat his dinner and was giving me attitude therefore he will be going to bed early which he hates more than just about anything.
Is that pretty similar to what you were looking for?
It sounds accurrate to say that Because the women of Zion were haughty and dressed up in jewelry an dtinkling feet, therefore God punished them. Just like Isaiah said. Then he said that because they were haughty He would take all their shiny toys and leave them with just a stink.
Are you trying to say God didn't punish them because they were haughty and wearing jewelry?
Isaiah 3:16 "Moreover, the Lord saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet:" Isaiah 3:17 "Therefore, the Lord will smite with a scab the crown of the head of the daughters of Zion, and the Lord will discover their secret parts."
The because is with those things listed in verse 16 only. So, because of those things in verse 16, God was punishing them by taking away their shiny toys and leaving them with a stink. What I'm saying is that there is no example of what follows the word "therefore" to mean that it was a cause of what is happening.
In your example: "Because my step son refused to eat his dinner and was giving me attitude therefore he will be going to bed early which he hates more than just about anything." Your son is being punished only for the reason that you mentioned before the "therefore". An example of what rdp is claiming would have to show the reason following the "therefore" after some of the judgments had already been mentioned. (Like they were in verse 17)
Umm...why are the women being punished then in your opinion? And why did God smite them with a scab?
Unless the reason was their haughtiness and jewelry God was just smiting them with scabs for the fun of it maybe?
Isaiah 3:16 "Moreover, the Lord saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet:" Those are the reasons I think they were punished.
Personally, I think the issue is tied VERY strongly to the issue of authority and headship. I do not believe it is proper for a woman to exercise the authority of office over men. Therefore I cannot accept the idea of a woman Pastor/Apostle. However, a preacher is not necessarily in authority. Most often, they are simply delivering an expository or allegorical message from the word. I preach very often, but I understand that under current church hierarchy...I have no authority. The peopel are not bound to obey anyone but the Pastor (no...I do not agree with this foolish idea, but thats the church world we live in).
In the end, I may be wrong and women preaching may be equally incorrect as Pastoring. However, I have not ever felt anything check my spirit on my opinion of them preaching. Thats not to say I go out of my way to listen to them. Personally, I've never heard a great one. I've heard some emotional ones. I've heard some that can appeal more effectively to the women in a church, but I have yet to hear any that I am "blown away" by so I don't pay much mind to them.
I must say that you seem to have an excellent spirit...which is quite refreshing on this thread!
Just one quick thought for your consideration [& I'll certainly do the same!]: I would say that the God-ordained ministry & the Word of God is, by its very nature, authoritative.....insomuch as the spoken word conforms to the written Word [which is the rub w/ the women "preacher" doctrine]. In sum, I would VERY KINDLY disagree that the 5-fold, God-ordained ministry is not authoritative, particulary when they're supposedly speaking for God & His Word. I hope that this is coming across in the grace that it's intended!
Woman is the "glory of man" & there's noooooo way on earth that I can see God ordaining the "glory of man" to bring forth His Word. "....that NO flesh would glory in His presence".
I do agree w/ your last statement [even though I've only heard one woman preacher on a CD that I happened to be in the vehicle riding in....it was quite repulsive]. I have seen a "woman preacher" testify a few times [I felt so embarrassed for one in particular that I wanted to go under the pew!]. Personally, I will not sit in a place if a woman preacher gets up to "preach"....& I also know many other the same way. In a nutshell, I will not sit for something that's sooooo blatantly contrary to the written Word..........Blessings, RDP.
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