Here's the bottom line. Do you really think that, regardless of origin, God will frown on someone using December 25 as a day to sincerely celebrate his birth and share gifts with family and friends? If you do, you're overthinking it. Are there reasons that the modern version of Christmas has been perverted into something materialistic and commercialized. Sure. Is that a reason not to observe it? Maybe so. I understand that position. But it can be celebrated in a spirit that is pleasing to God. I assure you.
I have a book chronicling the history of Christmas. As Christmas observance fell from it’s Christian practice it became a day of total revelry and debauchery. It was even outlawed in the United States for the first 50 years of our nation’s existence because it was seen as such a great social evil. With the advent of commercialization, the holiday was tamed and made into a family oriented celebration. Commercialization saved society from the dark Christmas riotous behavior. We, especially as a free market nation, should welcome commercialization’s ability to tame social issues such as these… not decry it.
By your logic then I can and should go out and buy a statue of buddha and stick a label that says "Jesus" on it and set it on my mantle with a candle burning beside it and by so doing I am honoring God by taking back an idol and changing it's name.
That logic is seriously flawed Bro. Sorry.
No… that’s really extreme. However, you might wish to use Buddha’s teachings that mirror Christ’s (such as the Golden Rule) to direct the interest of your Eastern seekers so that Christ not seem so alien to them. For example, notice what Paul did,
Acts 17:23 (New Living Translation)
23 for as I was walking along I saw your many shrines. And one of your altars had this inscription on it: ‘To an Unknown God.’ This God, whom you worship without knowing, is the one I’m telling you about.
Paul saw pagans worshiping in their pagan shrines and upon one pagan altar Paul noticed that there was an inscription on it reading: “To an Unknown God”. Now, for these pagans this was simply a generic altar to facilitate gods not represented or perhaps superstitiously a god they didn’t know about it. However, Paul takes this pagan custom and uses it to direct their attention to Jehovah God.
You might wish to tell your Eastern listeners that their Buddha may have taught them to do unto others as they would have others do unto them. However there is one greater than Buddha who is from Everlasting to Everlasting who said the same. Buddha’s enlightenment on the issue confirms that the only true God’s (Jesus Christ’s) teaching is indeed for them.
I guess I’m not Christian for celebrating Christmas??? If that’s the case…. I guess I never have been.
I didn't say you're not Christian.
Nor did I say anything, at all, about Christmas.
I am addressing the direction you are going with your research, studying, and questioning in general. A far, far deeper issue than any day of the year could ever be.
Please don't take offense where absolutely none is intended.
I can only see what you post, but I've read your posts since I started posting on another site almost 2.5 years ago. I've watched you take a direction that is definitely fascinating. I've taken it before too.
All I issue now is a caution. If you have someone with whom you can be accountable, please do so. Consider carefully what they say while you pursue the knowledge you're after. If you don't, please find someone.
I do not think the pursuit of knowledge in itself is dangerous. But I do know that the pursuit of knowledge without a safety net is. And the path out is a whole lot easier to walk than the path back in. All I'm asking is that you employ safety nets.
This has nothing at all to do with Christmas or Halloween or any other holiday or observance or pagan or Christian anything. I'm very intentionally leaving out of this thread what I believe or do in regards to any of those holidays.
__________________
You become free from who you have become, by becoming who you were meant to be. ~Mark from another forum I post on
God did it for us. Out of sheer generosity he put us in right standing with himself. A pure gift. He got us out of the mess we're in and restored us to where he always wanted us to be. And he did it by means of Jesus Christ. ~Romans 3:24 from The Message
I know you disagree. You'd have a Christian society without holidays, celebrations, rememberances (other than the Eucharist), decorations, cultural customs, etc. A dead religious body bent on the worship of strict adherence to a book... instead of a society freely glorifying God in all they do while maintaining their Christian liberty and cultural identity.
I'll never forget Evangelist/Missionary Bro. Addington. He did missions work with the Maori people. They have a "houka", a dramatic facial expression with eyes wide, painted faces, and tongues extended that is accompanied by vibrant and violent dancing. The custom is pagan and resembles their warrior cultural values. While preaching about waging war with the devil these Maori believers broke into a houka dance...in the middle of church... but instead of calling on their spirits to aid them in battle against evil spirits, they cried out in their language for Jesus to help them battle the devil. Many received the Holy Ghost in that service. You'd condemn them for this instead of seeing how wonderful a cultural shift this represents for them in their growing faith in Jesus Christ.
I am addressing the direction you are going with your research, studying, and questioning in general. A far, far deeper issue than any day of the year could ever be.
Please don't take offense where absolutely none is intended.
I can only see what you post, but I've read your posts since I started posting on another site almost 2.5 years ago. I've watched you take a direction that is definitely fascinating. I've taken it before too.
All I issue now is a caution. If you have someone with whom you can be accountable, please do so. Consider carefully what they say while you pursue the knowledge you're after. If you don't, please find someone.
I do not think the pursuit of knowledge in itself is dangerous. But I do know that the pursuit of knowledge without a safety net is. And the path out is a whole lot easier to walk than the path back in. All I'm asking is that you employ safety nets.
This has nothing at all to do with Christmas or Halloween or any other holiday or observance or pagan or Christian anything. I'm very intentionally leaving out of this thread what I believe or do in regards to any of those holidays.
I think I understand. I do speak to my pastor about things and we laugh quite a bit at times. He shakes his head and I ask why... and then he tells me his thoughts.
Can you be more specific on the things wherein my direction troubles you?
Do you read anything John posts? I think you're seriously pigeonholing him into a box he's never placed himself inside of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila
Awwww... John,
I know you disagree. You'd have a Christian society without holidays, celebrations, rememberances (other than the Eucharist), decorations, cultural customs, etc. A dead religious body bent on the worship of strict adherence to a book... instead of a society freely glorifying God in all they do while maintaining their Christian liberty and cultural identity.
I'll never forget Evangelist/Missionary Bro. Addington. He did missions work with the Maori people. They have a "houka", a dramatic facial expression with eyes wide, painted faces, and tongues extended that is accompanied by vibrant dancing. The custom is pagan and resembles their warrior cultural values. While preaching about waging war with the devil these Maori believers broke into a houka dance... but instead of calling on their spirits to aid them in battle against evil spirits, they cried out in their language for Jesus to help them battle the devil. You'd condemn them for this instead of seeing how wonderful a cultural shift this represents for them in their growing faith in Jesus Christ.
__________________
You become free from who you have become, by becoming who you were meant to be. ~Mark from another forum I post on
God did it for us. Out of sheer generosity he put us in right standing with himself. A pure gift. He got us out of the mess we're in and restored us to where he always wanted us to be. And he did it by means of Jesus Christ. ~Romans 3:24 from The Message
Do you read anything John posts? I think you're seriously pigeonholing him into a box he's never placed himself inside of.
I can only go by what he's writing.
What's the alternative? What are the implications of his reasonings? What would be the result if the Christian community adhered to his notions? It would produce exactly what I described. Can you, or John himself, show otherwise?
I think I understand. I do speak to my pastor about things and we laugh quite a bit at times. He shakes his head and I ask why... and then he tells me his thoughts.
Can you be more specific on the things wherein my direction troubles you?
The direction I've seen your posts go is very much the same direction I went before I stepped off into the occult. If I'd heeded caution, and kept the accountability I had in place at the time, I'd likely have been a lot better off. I don't think studying things is wrong, or bad, or dangerous in itself. But the more of that you do, the more I believe you need accountability. And I'm not talking about someone who laughs and shakes his head either. I'm talking about someone who will flat out tell you "that's not God" when you get off into something that's not. But you've got to be willing to heed that too. If not..studying these sort of things probably isn't a good idea.
__________________
You become free from who you have become, by becoming who you were meant to be. ~Mark from another forum I post on
God did it for us. Out of sheer generosity he put us in right standing with himself. A pure gift. He got us out of the mess we're in and restored us to where he always wanted us to be. And he did it by means of Jesus Christ. ~Romans 3:24 from The Message
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