Your not Oneness but rather Patripassionist - Page 8

watchman · #71 07-29-2010, 02:17 PM

Oneness Pentecostalism has been associated with patripassianism. According to Dr. Gary Reckart, Sr. an Apostolic Messianic : "If as Oneness believe, that God the Father was incarnate in Christ, which Jesus confessed ("it is the Father in me that doeth the work"), the Father was in Christ during all of the sufferings and being nailed to the cross. Thus the Father did suffer or experience the sufferings of the Son up to the time the Father departed from the body". Oneness Pentecostals have the belief that those that make statements like Dr. Reckart, the assumption that God the Father, a divine spirit becoming flesh (Jesus Christ the Son), would have to feel pain, is advancing a supposition much like Tertullian and other opponents of a Oneness doctrine. Dr. Reckart emphasizes that Oneness do not believe (as also the ancient patripassians did not) that the Father died on the cross as the Son, nor that the Father died to replace the death of the Son.

There are no known examples of any direct writings of Oneness Pentecostals ascribing to the belief of Patripassianism.

SRM · #72 07-29-2010, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchman

Oneness Pentecostalism has been associated with patripassianism. According to Dr. Gary Reckart, Sr. an Apostolic Messianic : "If as Oneness believe, that God the Father was incarnate in Christ, which Jesus confessed ("it is the Father in me that doeth the work"), the Father was in Christ during all of the sufferings and being nailed to the cross. Thus the Father did suffer or experience the sufferings of the Son up to the time the Father departed from the body". Oneness Pentecostals have the belief that those that make statements like Dr. Reckart, the assumption that God the Father, a divine spirit becoming flesh (Jesus Christ the Son), would have to feel pain, is advancing a supposition much like Tertullian and other opponents of a Oneness doctrine. Dr. Reckart emphasizes that Oneness do not believe (as also the ancient patripassians did not) that the Father died on the cross as the Son, nor that the Father died to replace the death of the Son.

There are no known examples of any direct writings of Oneness Pentecostals ascribing to the belief of Patripassianism.

Oneness believe the Father was manifested in the Son and some even assume Jesus was the Father in flesh.. thus saying..Jesus is God..

watchman · #73 07-29-2010, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SRM

Oneness believe the Father was manifested in the Son and some even assume Jesus was the Father in flesh.. thus saying..Jesus is God..

I know that is what I believe. However I do not believe the Father died on the cross.

seekerman · #74 07-30-2010, 07:39 AM

The Son of God, who preexisted His incarnation with His God and Father, died on the cross.

pastorrick1959 · #75 07-30-2010, 08:19 AM

[QUOTE=watchman;945418]What if you do believe Jesus was the Father incarnate as a man, but do not believe that God (The Father ) died on the Cross, but only the man He became? Would that be Oneness

who cares what anybody else calls it bro. if you consider yourself oneness then thats your label.

but in folllowing your question , i dont see how that would be possible . if the fahter became a man as you say and that was JESUS the son of god ,, then god died . he either was man or he wasnt . you have just got to make your choice.

pastorrick1959 · #76 07-30-2010, 08:21 AM

[QUOTE=watchman;945563]I know that is what I believe. However I do not believe the Father died on the cross

then you are very confused ... if the father turned into the son and the son died on cross ,, then god died.. period.

mfblume · #77 07-30-2010, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchman

Oneness Pentecostalism has been associated with patripassianism. According to Dr. Gary Reckart, Sr. an Apostolic Messianic : "If as Oneness believe, that God the Father was incarnate in Christ, which Jesus confessed ("it is the Father in me that doeth the work"), the Father was in Christ during all of the sufferings and being nailed to the cross. Thus the Father did suffer or experience the sufferings of the Son up to the time the Father departed from the body". Oneness Pentecostals have the belief that those that make statements like Dr. Reckart, the assumption that God the Father, a divine spirit becoming flesh (Jesus Christ the Son), would have to feel pain, is advancing a supposition much like Tertullian and other opponents of a Oneness doctrine. Dr. Reckart emphasizes that Oneness do not believe (as also the ancient patripassians did not) that the Father died on the cross as the Son, nor that the Father died to replace the death of the Son.

There are no known examples of any direct writings of Oneness Pentecostals ascribing to the belief of Patripassianism.

Gary Reckart is by no means a scholar on the subject of oneness though the likes to think he is.

watchman · #78 07-30-2010, 09:51 AM

[QUOTE=pastorrick1959;945616]

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchman

I know that is what I believe. However I do not believe the Father died on the cross

then you are very confused ... if the father turned into the son and the son died on cross ,, then god died.. period.

God is one and has always been one. Jesus is the man God became. Jesus did not exist before incarnation as God the Son. In His pre-incarnate state, He existed as the Father, God Himself. Now the two of them are in heaven together, God the Father and the man he became, the Son of God, Jesus Christ. The problem is that when I say the Father became a man people think it means I believe he stopped being an eternal Spirit after incarnation and that heaven was empty. This is not what I believe. God the Father continued to exist as a transcendent, unlimited Spirit, while also becoming a man. The Father did not become confined to a human existence. It is not as though the omnipresent Spirit of God transformed Himself into a man, to the exclusion of His existence as the Holy Spirit.

When God assumed a human existence with a complete human mind, psyche, will, and emotion etc. He was distinct from the Father while he continued to exist as the Father in heaven. As a genuine human being, Jesus was and is distinct from the Father. This is because of His humanity not because he is the second person of the Trinity. While I confess that the deity of the Son did pre-exist incarnation, I do not see that deity as the second person of the Trinity, known as " God the Son ", and separate from the Father or Holy Spirit, but rather as the uni-personal God of the old testament. Yahweh, the Father, the Great I Am.

Only the man that was born, and lived as a man died. The Father did not die for He cannot die.

mfblume · #79 07-30-2010, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pastorrick1959

David Benard teaches Jesus Christ had a DUAL nature which is a thought I do not agree with.Scripture is very clear who Jesus was..He no where claimed to be God not one time anytime nowhere.God cannot be seen,Jesus made known the Father to the world but to say when someone saw Jesus they were looking AT the Father in a human body IMHO is not scriptural

i agree srm.. fully. and i am oneness,,, the dual nature doctrine of err which benard teaches, is a 2 god doctrine ..or at leasst a very confused doctrine ..that simply cant make up their mind.

You are not oneness if you believe Jesus is not God manifested in, not become, flesh. You may be MONOTHEIST, but not oneness. Bro Bernard is correct. Jesus is both 100% God and 100% man. But God is not a man. THE PERSON of God is the PERSON of the man Jesus.

mfblume · #80 07-30-2010, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SRM

Oneness believe the Father was manifested in the Son and some even assume Jesus was the Father in flesh.. thus saying..Jesus is God..

You said Jesus is MIGHTY GOD but not ALMIGHTY GOD. I thought seekerman said that, but I just saw it was you. Do you realize you are saying there are TWO GODS? 1) Almighty God, 2) Mighty God.