For those that left the UPC... - Page 58

onefaith2 · #**571** 09-24-2010, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

He is identifying, to the hearers, that the title "Lord" is none other than Jesus Christ. It is not a baptismal formula. It is a revelation.

I disagree with the above. Paul is reiterating what Ananias was telling him to do, arise and be baptized and wash away your sin, calling on the name of the Lord.

Thats not the context of the revelation, that is the retelling of the event.

Pressing-On · #**572** 09-24-2010, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by missourimary

People can read the posts and determine for themselves what they want to think. But to tell me that I'm "watering down the power and importance of His name" is your idea of what I said, and it's a wrong conclusion. I could just as easily say that you are watering down the power and importance of His blood and His grace, if I were to use the same reasoning you are.

The power of Jesus' name is not in the name itself, but what that name represents.

I think we need to be careful where we put our emphasis, myself included. And I do believe that everything is important - the name itself, what that name represents, His grace, His mercy, His blood, our hearts, our minds, how we represent Him in our service and commitment, etc. Nothing stands alone.

But, to argue about what to say or who says what in regards to baptism is overlooking the power and revelation of His name.

Pressing-On · #**573** 09-24-2010, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onefaith2

I disagree with the above. Paul is reiterating what Ananias was telling him to do, arise and be baptized and wash away your sin, calling on the name of the Lord.

Thats not the context of the revelation, that is the retelling of the event.

When you read the account in Acts 9:18, it simply says, "And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized."

Acts 22:16 is Paul's account of the ordeal and it appears, IMO, that he is teaching a truth to those that want to have him killed. He is sharing why he believes what he believes and why he has perfect understanding of it.

Praxeas · #**574** 09-25-2010, 02:16 AM

Act 22:13 coming to me and standing by, said to me, Brother Saul, look up! And the same hour I looked up on him.
Act 22:14 And he said, The God of our fathers has chosen you to know His will and to see the Just One, and to hear a voice out of His mouth.
Act 22:15 For you shall be His witness to all men of what you have seen and heard.
Act 22:16 And now what do you intend? Arise and be baptized and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Pressing-On · #**575** 09-25-2010, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Act 22:13 coming to me and standing by, said to me, Brother Saul, look up! And the same hour I looked up on him.
Act 22:14 And he said, The God of our fathers has chosen you to know His will and to see the Just One, and to hear a voice out of His mouth.
Act 22:15 For you shall be His witness to all men of what you have seen and heard.
Act 22:16 And now what do you intend? Arise and be baptized and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

But, is Ananias teaching him a truth, as in Acts 2:21 "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." and Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." or is he telling him what to say when he is baptized?

Godsdrummer · #**576** 09-25-2010, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

But, is Ananias teaching him a truth, as in Acts 2:21 "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." and Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." or is he telling him what to say when he is baptized?

JMHO
He is simply teaching him that our sins are forgiven when we call on the name of the Lord. Baptism has nothing to do with anything other than our sign of agrement to the world. Just as circumcision was a seal of righteousness of Abrahams faith, so is baptism for us today.

Pressing-On · #**577** 09-25-2010, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

JMHO
He is simply teaching him that our sins are forgiven when we call on the name of the Lord. Baptism has nothing to do with anything other than our sign of agrement to the world. Just as circumcision was a seal of righteousness of Abrahams faith, so is baptism for us today.

But, he says, "arise and be baptized and wash away they sins..."

If he is forgiven at repentance or when he calls on the name of the Lord, why is baptizing washing away his sins? It seems as though Acts 2:38 would be correct when it says, "Repent and be baptized for the remission of your sins."

And I Peter 3:21 says, "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us..."

Falla39 · #**578** 09-25-2010, 08:54 AM

In Acts 10, even after the Holy Ghost fell on all those (gentiles) that heard the Word,
Peter still commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.

Godsdrummer · #**579** 09-25-2010, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

But, he says, "arise and be baptized and wash away they sins..."

If he is forgiven at repentance or when he calls on the name of the Lord, why is baptizing washing away his sins? It seems as though Acts 2:38 would be correct when it says, "Repent and be baptized for the remission of your sins."

And I Peter 3:21 says, "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us..."

There is a forgoten teaching in UPC because of the teaching of baptism remiting of sin. It is that Acts 2:38 actualy says "to be baptized in Jesus Name because of the remission of sin". UPI's hinging everything on Acts 2:38 blinds their eyes to the rest of what the bible says.

Ananias tells Paul to go and be baptized AND wash away his sin by calling on the name of the Lord.

As for I Peter what was the like figure? That the water saved Noah? Or God saved Noah? Peter is very clear that baptism is not the washing of sin as he says "not the putting away of the filth of the flesh" but because we have a clean conciance before God. Baptism is our telling the world we identifiy with Jesus Christ because God has washed our sin away and we have a clear conciance before God.

It is so clear when you put all scripture in context, and not what the traditions of man dictate.

Pressing-On · #**580** 09-25-2010, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

There is a forgoten teaching in UPC because of the teaching of baptism remiting of sin. It is that Acts 2:38 actualy says "to be baptized in Jesus Name because of the remission of sin". UPI's hinging everything on Acts 2:38 blinds their eyes to the rest of what the bible says.

Ananias tells Paul to go and be baptized AND wash away his sin by calling on the name of the Lord.

As for I Peter what was the like figure? That the water saved Noah? Or God saved Noah? Peter is very clear that baptism is not the washing of sin as he says "not the putting away of the filth of the flesh" but because we have a clean conciance before God. Baptism is our telling the world we identifiy with Jesus Christ because God has washed our sin away and we have a clear conciance before God.

It is so clear when you put all scripture in context, and not what the traditions of man dictate.

I knew when I mentioned Acts 2:38 someone would bring up the UPC. I wasn't raised UPC and could care less, really. I'm not discussing any of this in support of an organization. I'm reading and studying the Word for myself, not because I belong to an organization. Just wanted to mentioned that little tidbit of information, for all it's worth. LOL!

Anyway, back on topic - But, he did say to "wash", and it does say that "baptism" does save us. Yes, it is an answer of a good conscience, but our conscience wouldn't be clean if we didn't get in the water and our sins wouldn't be washed away if we didn't get in the water.

And I Peter 1:20 does say that the water saved 8 souls - "that is, eight souls were saved by water."

So, when Paul or Ananias say, "calling on the name of the Lord", that is a huge revelation and truth that covers so much. The Gospels are centered around the prophecies concerning Him, His triumphal entry and the anger of those that opposed Him, not believing He was who He claimed to be, being blinded by their unbelief. I just think it is more involved than saying that it is the only example of what someone is supposed to say when they are baptized - going back to the original intent of the discussion. At least, I think that's what we have been talking about. LOL!

Back to my tedious painting project.