Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

[jfrog]

onefaith2, you seem reasonable. Maybe you can you answer a question of mine. In 1 Peter 3:3 why do some translations include the word fine/beautiful before clothes/apparel and others do not?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

There was no "church" for the early church as we know it. Actually if you look at other translations they all conclude everwhere, every place.

lol

CHURCH is the GATHERING OF PEOPLE, not a building as such.

1 Corinthians 14:18-19 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: (19) Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

Notice Paul contrasted "in the church" with other instances in his life, and he meant when gathered "wherever" with saints. Being with a group of people gathered in a house to worship is "IN THE CHURCH".

That is what Paul spoke to Timothy about. We lift up holy hands when gathered to worship, of2. Not every day of our general lives.

It is saying EVERY WHERE we can have church. Church is any place where people gather in His name.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by mfblume

lol

CHURCH is the GATHERING OF PEOPLE, not a building as such.

1 Corinthians 14:18-19 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: (19) Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

Notice Paul contrasted "in the church" with other instances in his life, and he meant when gathered "wherever" with saints. Being with a group of people gathered in a house to worship is "IN THE CHURCH".

That is what Paul spoke to Timothy about. We lift up holy hands when gathered to worship, of2. Not every day of our general lives.

It is saying EVERY WHERE we can have church. Church is any place where people gather in His name.

No.. every translation except NLT says every where or every place.. it does not mention a place of worship only.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by jfrog

onefaith2, you seem reasonable. Maybe you can you answer a question of mine. In 1 Peter 3:3 why do some translations include the word fine/beautiful before clothes/apparel and others do not?

Good question? Which translation?

This one is saying

1 Peter 3:3 (Contemporary English Version)
3Don't depend on things like fancy hairdos or gold jewelry or expensive clothes to make you look beautiful.


All of the above makes one look beautiful but Paul is exhorting based on this scripture to not depend on those things to make one look beautiful. This is not the "not with" per say as it doesn't seem to be a total ban, but rather what godly women should choose.

Here is another interesting one

1 Peter 3
1Wives, in a similar way, place yourselves under your husbands’ authority. Some husbands may not obey God’s word. Their wives could win these men for Christ by the way they live without saying anything. 2Their husbands would see how pure and reverent their lives are.

3Wives must not let their beauty be something external. Beauty doesn’t come from hairstyles, gold jewelry, or clothes. 4Rather, beauty is something internal that can’t be destroyed. Beauty expresses itself in a gentle and quiet attitude which God considers precious. 5After all, this is how holy women who had confidence in God expressed their beauty in the past. They placed themselves under their husbands’ authority 6as Sarah did. Sarah obeyed Abraham and spoke to him respectfully. You became Sarah’s daughters by not letting anything make you afraid to do good.

7Husbands, in a similar way, live with your wives with understanding since they are weaker than you are. Honor your wives as those who share God’s life-giving kindness[a] so that nothing will interfere with your prayers.

[houston]

I can feel it coming in the air tonight...

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

No.. every translation except NLT says every where or every place.. it does not mention a place of worship only.

It does not have to mention a place of worship. The reason one version says that is because of the reference to lifting up holy hands. In other words, the reference to lifting up holy hands is the qualifier to let us know it is talking about places of worship. Otherwise we would not read about men lifting up holy hands without wrath or doubting, but more generally that men simply stop doubting and having wrath!

Every word counts in the bible. We cannot dismiss the lifting up of holy hands and think it has no significance.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by mfblume

It does not have to mention a place of worship. The reason one version says that is because of the reference to lifting up holy hands. In other words, the reference to lifting up holy hands is the qualifier to let us know it is talking about places of worship. Otherwise we would not read about men lifting up holy hands without wrath or doubting, but more generally that men simply stop doubting and having wrath!

Every word counts in the bible. We cannot dismiss the lifting up of holy hands and think it has no significance.

One can lift up holy hands anywhere, Mike. I hope you can see that. The translations disagree with you. Actually the message bible I believe states for men not to shake their fists at God with anger and doubting.

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

Good question? Which translation?

This one is saying

1 Peter 3:3 (Contemporary English Version)
3Don't depend on things like fancy hairdos or gold jewelry or expensive clothes to make you look beautiful.


All of the above makes one look beautiful but Paul is exhorting based on this scripture to not depend on those things to make one look beautiful. This is not the "not with" per say as it doesn't seem to be a total ban, but rather what godly women should choose.

Here is another interesting one

1 Peter 3
1Wives, in a similar way, place yourselves under your husbands’ authority. Some husbands may not obey God’s word. Their wives could win these men for Christ by the way they live without saying anything. 2Their husbands would see how pure and reverent their lives are.

3Wives must not let their beauty be something external. Beauty doesn’t come from hairstyles, gold jewelry, or clothes. 4Rather, beauty is something internal that can’t be destroyed. Beauty expresses itself in a gentle and quiet attitude which God considers precious. 5After all, this is how holy women who had confidence in God expressed their beauty in the past. They placed themselves under their husbands’ authority 6as Sarah did. Sarah obeyed Abraham and spoke to him respectfully. You became Sarah’s daughters by not letting anything make you afraid to do good.

7Husbands, in a similar way, live with your wives with understanding since they are weaker than you are. Honor your wives as those who share God’s life-giving kindness[a] so that nothing will interfere with your prayers.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

One can lift up holy hands anywhere, Mike. I hope you can see that. The translations disagree with you. Actually the message bible I believe states for men not to shake their fists at God with anger and doubting.

That may be so. I agree men can lift up hands anywhere. It's just that I think it is mentioning that anywhere where there is church... And one translation you quoted did agree with me.

1 Timothy 2:8 (New Living Translation)

8 In every place of worship, I want men to pray with holy hands lifted up to God, free from anger and controversy.

(do we only worship at church?)

Places of worship are churches.


But that is not my main argument, anyway.

It still stands that God would not contradict Himself to forbid all wearing of jewelry and then use it in other instances to indicate blessing and condoning of it.

[acerrak]

most churches back then were in secret. hidden. exspecially during the persecution.
there are caves in ephesus today were christians hid and had fellowship.

it is also the one reason why the fish symbol was made. it was like a secret symbol to allow other christians to know that they were followers of Christ with out hanging a sign on there door. Good history.