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01-03-2008, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
God justifies us according to our faith
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But is faith the end, the destination to our salvation or is faith a means to salvation? IOW are we justified at the moment of faith? or is faith a vehicle to the new birth and becoming part of the body of Christ?
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE....  My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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01-03-2008, 03:19 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dallas,TX
Posts: 132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
Augustinian, you know you can use the qoute butten and it will quote the entire content and then you can break each quote up into smaller quote boxes by using the yellow quot butten at the top of the editor?
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Thanx Praxeas. I was just about to ask somebody that very question.
a
__________________
"Love God and do what you please"
-St. Augustine
sola Christus
sola gratia
sola fide
sola deo gloria
sola scriptura
tota scriputra
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01-03-2008, 04:04 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
But is faith the end, the destination to our salvation or is faith a means to salvation? IOW are we justified at the moment of faith? or is faith a vehicle to the new birth and becoming part of the body of Christ?
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I didn't say salvation. God justifies us by our faith. A person that is justified can then enter into relation with God, otherwise God does not hear him.
Justification brings us into a right position with God so that we can receive the promises and blessings of God.
Abraham was justified first, his works gave evidence to that faith second and because of that God was able to deal with him, make promises and Abraham was able to believe and accept those promises which brought him into a new land. Had he disobeyed God he would not have received those promises....had he not had faith he never would have had those promises made to him.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-03-2008, 04:04 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by augustianian
Thanx Praxeas. I was just about to ask somebody that very question.
a
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You are welcome. 
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-03-2008, 08:48 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
I didn't say salvation. God justifies us by our faith. A person that is justified can then enter into relation with God, otherwise God does not hear him.
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God heard me when I prayed to him before I repented.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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01-03-2008, 08:54 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
God heard me when I prayed to him before I repented.
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Right, because you had FAITH. You were JUSTIFIED when you had FAITH.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-03-2008, 09:03 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
Right, because you had FAITH. You were JUSTIFIED when you had FAITH.
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I hadn't even repented and you say I was justified? Is there an element of forgiveness in being justified?
I was a sinner. I sinned before I prayed and I sinned after I prayed. I didn't repent until about 5-6 months later. But I know that God heard my prayer because He answered it.
I don't know, Prax, if I understand what you are saying.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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01-03-2008, 09:10 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
I hadn't even repented and you say I was justified? Is there an element of forgiveness in being justified?
I was a sinner. I sinned before I prayed and I sinned after I prayed. I didn't repent until about 5-6 months later. But I know that God heard my prayer because He answered it.
I don't know, Prax, if I understand what you are saying.
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We are justified by faith, not by repentance. We are regarded to be just persons, by our faith through Christs own Righteousness in the eyes of God.
We are righteous...but not because our works are righteous or perfect but because Christ's righteousness is imputed to us, not imparted to us
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-03-2008, 09:20 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
We are justified by faith, not by repentance. We are regarded to be just persons, by our faith through Christs own Righteousness in the eyes of God.
We are righteous...but not because our works are righteous or perfect but because Christ's righteousness is imputed to us, not imparted to us
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Prax,
This is what you said:
Quote:
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God justifies us by our faith. A person that is justified can then enter into relation with God, otherwise God does not hear him.
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I'm saying God heard me when I prayed to Him asking Him to have mercy on me but I did not repent at that I time. I made absolutely no promises to obey Him, I only asked for his mercy to let me live and not die. But He HEARD me. He answered my prayer. The thing that had been bothering me left me....I no longer felt a premonition of impending doom like my time on this earth was coming to an end. I did not feel righteous nor did I feel like I was in a right relationship with God. I didn't even know if the gospel of Jesus Christ was true. I prayed to God, whoever God may have been, not to Jesus. Why would God impute righteousness to me when I didn't even confess Christ?
Later, months later, I read the gospels and believed them and repented.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
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01-03-2008, 10:08 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh
Prax,
This is what you said:
I'm saying God heard me when I prayed to Him asking Him to have mercy on me but I did not repent at that I time. I made absolutely no promises to obey Him, I only asked for his mercy to let me live and not die. But He HEARD me. He answered my prayer. The thing that had been bothering me left me....I no longer felt a premonition of impending doom like my time on this earth was coming to an end. I did not feel righteous nor did I feel like I was in a right relationship with God. I didn't even know if the gospel of Jesus Christ was true. I prayed to God, whoever God may have been, not to Jesus. Why would God impute righteousness to me when I didn't even confess Christ?
Later, months later, I read the gospels and believed them and repented.
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I know that was what you were saying. You had faith. God heard you because of you faith. Your faith is what justifies you, not your good works.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
|
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