Thank you for the respectful and thoughtful comments and questions! It's refreshing.
I've said before that everyone should do what works for them. If faith in God works, great! Keep it up! If it doesn't, then try something else! That's what I did, and it's like night and day. Still not perfect, and no philosophy or religion ever will be, I suppose, but it works best. I'm alive!
Oh, that reminds me, I owe a post to someone on what works for me -- it slipped my mind. We've highjacked this thread beyond recognition, so maybe I'll start a new thread. Or find that other one.
All the best!
Yes..it seems like this thread is all over the place now. LOL
Is that all you really have to offer? A smiley face? Really? No answers to any of my questions?
Sigh. OK. I'll answer each question:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob's Ladder
Why not dialog with people of like-minded belief?
There's not much point to that. (More below.)
Quote:
You state chatting with Christians is fun?
Yes, I did.
Quote:
You consider dialoging with Christians fun?
Yes, I do.
Quote:
I am sure you have more exciting things to do rather than chatting on a forum with people who oppose your method of belief. What are you trying to accomplish by dialoging with “Christians?”
(Quote marks. )
Yes, I have more exciting things to do, and I do more exciting things. I'm not on AFF 24x7.
Quote:
What is it you seek here?
I seek the Holy Grail.
But seriously, I came here originally just to explore something I wasn't very familiar with. Since then, I became an agnostic, but stayed for several reasons: I made some friends here. I like provoking thought, and sometimes in avenues that folks may not have explored before. I like prodding and poking and, yes, rocking boats. And stirring pots, now and then.
But another reason I stay is that I would like to demonstrate to you good folks that the world is bigger than your religion -- that some people outside of it are not such bad people. We're not evil. We're not fools. We live our lives without your dogma and we get along fine. Better, in fact, that some people in the dogma.
There may be some that are in this fold that shouldn't be. (Gasp!) Maybe some of my posts my wake them up.
Quote:
If you are agnostic, you should be on an agnostic forum reaffirming and strengthening your agnostic belief with other agnostic individuals.
No. Where's the fun in that?
But, really? I've never been to an agnostic forum, but, well, what would it be like, anyway? What is there to "reaffirm" or "strengthen", and why would we want to do that?
The agnostic "dogma", if you want to call it that, doesn't include any tenets that I know of protecting it from the incursion of doubts or "false doctrine". The Agnostic Bible, if it existed, wouldn't have passages that say "if anyone brings you a different agnosticism than the on in this book, let them be accursed" or "lean not on your own understanding of agnosticism" or "agnosticism's ways are not our ways" or.... You get the idea. Maybe.
(Now watch. Someone will find an "Agnostic Bible" somewhere and post a link, just to prove me wrong. Well. That's cool. Learn something new every day. But I really hope it doesn't have those things I said it wouldn't have! )
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
But another reason I stay is that I would like to demonstrate to you good folks that the world is bigger than your religion -- that some people outside of it are not such bad people. We're not evil. We're not fools. We live our lives without your dogma and we get along fine. Better, in fact, that some people in the dogma.
There may be some that are in this fold that shouldn't be. (Gasp!) Maybe some of my posts my wake them up.
Not fools? Well, Timmy, you would have to qualify what the Bible considers a fool, and what you consider a fool. Those who follow the Bible and believe it is a guide to their lives would believe that anyone who rejected their God or didn't believe in God (to quote the Psalm,) would be a fool. No hard feelings, but to hang around a religious forum to "provoke" or try to convert the people isn't the best way to win friends and influence them. It would be like an ex-Atheist who was once an Atheist; being a member of an Atheist board, then getting an epiphany to wake the others up. The reaction is the same, the endeavor becomes futile as the other Atheists (who witness their former members metamorphosis) try to "provoke" them. Monty Python? That's going to convert who? How is your campaign against Christianity working around the people you use to attend church with?
How many in your town who attended church with you convert to your current belief?
__________________ "all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
But seriously, I came here originally just to explore something I wasn't very familiar with. Since then, I became an agnostic, but stayed for several reasons: I made some friends here. I like provoking thought, and sometimes in avenues that folks may not have explored before. I like prodding and poking and, yes, rocking boats. And stirring pots, now and then.
You mean, you like to undermine the faith of those who are weak in the faith or lack the knowledge to answer your posts? When I was a new Christian, I met people in real life who tried to destroy my faith by making fun of it or asking questions I did not know how to answer. Of course all those attacks forced me to study the word of God and grow up, but I wonder how many new Christians have been destroyed by atheists just prodding and poking and rocking their boats.
Atheists do not want to go to heaven, yet they hinder those who would go in.
Is that not evil?
But another reason I stay is that I would like to demonstrate to you good folks that the world is bigger than your religion -- that some people outside of it are not such bad people. We're not evil. We're not fools. We live our lives without your dogma and we get along fine. Better, in fact, that some people in the dogma.
Of course the world is bigger than our religion, but bigger does not make it better. It is not a matter of being evil, it is a matter of being righteous before God. Of course no one is a fool in his own eyes, the whole world could call someone a fool, yet the fool will simply reject their assessment of him.
There may be some that are in this fold that shouldn't be. (Gasp!) Maybe some of my posts my wake them up.
How can you who are dead in your sins, awake anyone?
The Bible says awake to righteousness.
In truth I feel sad for you, for you are indeed a pitiful creature, without God or hope in this world or the next.
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**Original Matthew 28:19 Restored**
Not fools? Well, Timmy, you would have to qualify what the Bible considers a fool, and what you consider a fool. Those who follow the Bible and believe it is a guide to their lives would believe that anyone who rejected their God or didn't believe in God (to quote the Psalm,) would be a fool. No hard feelings, but to hang around a religious forum to "provoke" or try to convert the people isn't the best way to win friends and influence them. It would be like an ex-Atheist who was once an Atheist; being a member of an Atheist board, then getting an epiphany to wake the others up. The reaction is the same, the endeavor becomes futile as the other Atheists (who witness their former members metamorphosis) try to "provoke" them. Monty Python? That's going to convert who? How is your campaign against Christianity working around the people you use to attend church with?
How many in your town who attended church with you convert to your current belief?
Uh, yeah, I know what the Bible says about me. I would say it's wrong. And you could come up with some kind of looser interpretation (and some believers have) short of literally thinking I am a fool for not believing the same thing you do. You'd look less arrogant, for one thing.
(I might say it would have been foolish of me to stay in the dogma, when it was killing me. Believe me or don't. Up to you.)
Nearly all of my real-world friendships with former fellow believers are just fine, thank you. Attended a wedding just the other day, and it was like old times. (One exception, kinda, is the occasional unfriending on FB after I posted some things about gay marriage or whatever. Funny, though, in the cases that we later saw each other in real life, it was like it never happened. So maybe they're are real exceptions, either. Just a bit strange. But I understand, some people don't like reading opinions that differ from their own.)
I have friends here. Many enjoy reading my posts. Some have gone so far to say they would leaf AFF if I left.
Was I trying to convert anyone with the Monty Python thing? Again, someone tries to read my mind, and fails miserably. You guys (some of you) think you know things. You don't. You should stop pretending to.
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
By the way, my "campaign against Christianity"? Odd campaign, isn't it, that includes, uh, "tactics" such as telling everyone to do what works for them, including their religion?
Very few AFFers have shown me the courtesy to tell me that. Strange.
(OK, not really strange, I know. Not when you consider the dogma, such as the "fool" discussion we just had. The dogma says it is the only thing that will work. So it doesn't really surprise me.)
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
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