Ohhhhh, haha! Very cute--a cultural reference. What hilarious lyrics--I've never heard that song before.
Kinda reminds me of the new Beyonce hit--"If you liked it, then you shoulda put a ring on it." LOL!
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"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
Awesome thread! However I have one point of difference...
Quote:
Within the pages of scripture you have various sexual sins being committed, polygamy, love triangles, disobedient marriages between unbelievers and believers. Homosexuality, incest, loveless marriages, divorces, rape, son sleeping with stepmother, adultery, false rape allegations, etc. Day Time Soap Operas have nothing on scripture.
In the Bible God's Law often commanded polygamy. In addition God declares that he gave David his wives. How can polygamy be sin if a commandment leads to polygamy and if God himself declares that he gave David his wives?
Certainly polygamy is prohibitted by NT standards of marriage and intimacy, which appear to be dispensational. The unit is to reflect one Christ and one bride. While polygamy violates the NT model of marriage, I can't bring myself to say it's sin if God commanded it and gave wives (plural) to men.
I think it's intended to be a way of setting safe boundaries--not an actual *feeling.*
It's a good way to make boys understand how they should respect the girl they're with. "Don't do anything to your date that you wouldn't do to your sister." (I think he meant "sister" in the sense of "brother or sister in Christ"--not a physical sibling.)
*ahem*
I'm assuming that Keith doesn't believe in hand-holding, hugging and kissing until marriage. I have to say...all that touchy stuff always leads to other touchy stuff! Not a terrible idea, just keeping your hands to yourself.
Nope, I failed in this area, held hands and too much!
Seriously this is a good principle that is often failed to be taught.
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My personal mission is to BRING people into a right relationship with God, GROW them up to maturity and SEND them back into the world to minister.
Last edited by Pastor Keith; 02-12-2010 at 12:42 PM.
Awesome thread! However I have one point of difference...
In the Bible God's Law often commanded polygamy. In addition God declares that he gave David his wives. How can polygamy be sin if a commandment leads to polygamy and if God himself declares that he gave David his wives?
Certainly polygamy is prohibitted by NT standards of marriage and intimacy, which appear to be dispensational. The unit is to reflect one Christ and one bride.
While polygamy violates the NT model of marriage, I can't bring myself to say it's sin if God commanded it and gave wives (plural) to men.
Can you explain to me how these two statement can coexist in the same thought???
I do not see how you can say in one breath that certainly something violates scripture, and is prohibited; and in the next breath say you cannot call it sin?
Can you explain to me how these two statement can coexist in the same thought???
I do not see how you can say in one breath that certainly something violates scripture, and is prohibited; and in the next breath say you cannot call it sin?
I agree... originally, God made man w/one wife and that is his model... including the NT which is also modeled wChrist/church.
I believe that God allowed the many wives of David and others, it was culture of heathen nations rubbing off, but not God's intended plan or desire at all. He allowed divorces in OT, but that was not his desire from the beginning either. Lots of distorted view points passed down through generations... but I think just going back to the beginning shows us God's plan.
Awesome thread! However I have one point of difference...
In the Bible God's Law often commanded polygamy. In addition God declares that he gave David his wives. How can polygamy be sin if a commandment leads to polygamy and if God himself declares that he gave David his wives?
Certainly polygamy is prohibitted by NT standards of marriage and intimacy, which appear to be dispensational. The unit is to reflect one Christ and one bride. While polygamy violates the NT model of marriage, I can't bring myself to say it's sin if God commanded it and gave wives (plural) to men.
God changes His mind a lot! Many things have been removed from the list of sins, of course, but sometimes new things are added, too.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
I agree... originally, God made man w/one wife and that is his model... including the NT which is also modeled wChrist/church.
I believe that God allowed the many wives of David and others, it was culture of heathen nations rubbing off, but not God's intended plan or desire at all. He allowed divorces in OT, but that was not his desire from the beginning either. Lots of distorted view points passed down through generations... but I think just going back to the beginning shows us God's plan.
Sin is always sin and God never tolerates sin. However, just because something isn't a "sin" it doesn't mean it was God's original plan. Clearly polygamy isn't a "sin". In fact we read that God gave David "wives",
2 Samuel 12:8.
"And I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah; and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things."
Please note that this is part of Nathan's rebuke regarding David's adultery. In comparison David's adultery was detestable in God's sight, however, God professes that he blessed David with his master's "wives". God wouldn't have blessed David with something sinful. In fact God states that He would have blessed David with more "such and such things" had those things (including the wives) had been too little. Here the two can be compared and clearly polygamy isn't regarded as adultery in God's eyes.
Also note,
1 Kings 15:5
"Because David did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD, and turned not aside from any thing that he commanded him all the days of his life, save only in the matter of Uriah the Hittite. "
Again, David's polygamy isn't regarded as sin.
The Bible's regulations on sex are typically an issue of social justice. Marriage protected women in a hostile patriarchal world. This is one reason why God commanded that if a man dies his brother is to marry his wife or wives, even if he himself were already married. It was to protect women and multiply the nation.
So polygamy, in my opinion, while surely complicated and possibly detrimental, isn't a "sin" per se. If it's sin... most of the righteous men of the Bible died in sin. Also consider, David and Solomon who had many wives are authors of Scripture. It's conceivable that when a Psalm or Proverb was written the author (David or Solomon) had been with a different woman that evening than the night before. Yet their words are divinely inspired and holy. Consider also that the first five books of the Bible, the Pentateuch, were written by Moses... a man who was married to Zipporah and an Ethiopian woman (Exodus 2:15-16,21; 18:1-6; Numbers 12:1-15). Yet the Ten Commandments that Moses delivered and the rest of his writings are indeed inspired by God and holy.
So again, while we agree that polygamy isn't ideal, I doubt we can call it a "sin".
Lastly we must consider that Paul writes in the NT about elders having one wife. In other texts regarding marital relations Paul speaks of spouses in monogamous marriage.
We often say that Paul wrote this because monogamy illustrates one Lord and one church. And it does. But it's important to note that Paul was living in the Roman Empire. Many don't know this, but polygamy was banned in the Roman Empire a couple hundred years before Christ. Therefore we must also understand that Paul would have written admonishments in relation to what was legal in Roman society. This was perhaps one way in which Paul expected Christians to obey the ordinance of human government (Romans 13:1-3).
So while Paul uses monogamy as an image reflecting Christ and the church, we have to understand that Paul didn't initiate it's prohibition. Rome had already prohibited polygamy. The question would be, if Rome hadn't prohibited polygamy, would Paul's writings reflect the same values of the Patriarchs of the Old Testament?
God changes His mind a lot! Many things have been removed from the list of sins, of course, but sometimes new things are added, too.
Yes, God's methods with man differ from dispensation to dispensation. That's why we have to consider what covenant is being operated within, social conditions, and cultural norms when reading various passages that appear to indicate that God changed his mind about a thing.
Yes, God's methods with man differ from dispensation to dispensation. That's why we have to consider what covenant is being operated within, social conditions, and cultural norms when reading various passages that appear to indicate that God changed his mind about a thing.
And you better know what covenant is in effect, if you want to get saved. Sacrificing animals used to work, but not anymore!
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
too much! 
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