FOX Lies!! Barack Obama Pastor Wright - Page 53

ChristopherHall · #**521** 03-25-2008, 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

So, when we allow people to come to our nation and smoke us to smithereens, then we will be justified as you are making them out to be???

I'd rather stop them before they get here, even if it means smoking their children.

Call me callous, but my children and their safety come first. Not theirs.

Don't you trust God to protect you and your family?

ChristopherHall · #**522** 03-25-2008, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReformedDave

Chris picks and chooses the rules in which he sets up his arbitrary worldview.

Actually my view is the classical view of most fundamentalist churches. I didn't make it to my office last night, but I have resources there I can draw upon to show that Bible believing Christians in America have only recently embraced war as a "Christian" option.

I admonish you to read the Articles of Faith of the United Pentecostal Church International:

Quote:

CONSCIENTIOUS SCRUPLES

We recognize the institution of human government as being of divine ordination, and, in so doing, affirm unswerving loyalty to our Government; however, we take a definite position regarding the bearing of arms or the taking of human life.

As followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, the Prince of Peace, we believe in implicit obedience to His commandments and precepts which instruct us as follows: ".. that ye resist not evil. . ." (Matt. 5:39): "Follow peace with all men..." (Heb. 12:14). (See also Matt. 26:52; Rom. 12:19; James 5:6; Revelation 13:10). These we believe and interpret to mean Christians shall not shed blood nor take human life.

Therefore, we propose to fulfill all the obligations of loyal citizens, but are constrained to declare against participating in combatant service in war, armed insurrection, property destruction, aiding or abetting in or the actual destruction of human life.

Furthermore, we cannot conscientiously affiliate with any union, boycott, or organization which will force or bind any of its members to belong to any organization, perform any duties contrary to our conscience, or receive any mark, without our right to affirm or reject same (1930).

However, we regret the false impression created by some groups or so-called "conscientious objectors" that to obey the Bible is to have a contempt for law or magistrates, to be disloyal to our Government and in sympathy with our enemies, or to be unwilling to sacrifice for the preservation of our commonwealth. This attitude would be as contemptible to us as to any patriot. The Word of God commands us to do violence to no man. It also commands us that first of all we are to pray for rulers of our country. We, therefore, exhort our members to freely and willingly respond to the call of our Government except in the matter of bearing arms. When we say service, we mean service-no matter how hard or dangerous. The true church has no more place for cowards than has the nation. First of all, however, let us earnestly pray that we will with honor be kept out of war.

We believe that we can be consistent in serving our Government in certain noncombatant capacities, but not in the bearing of arms. (1940).

We further believe that our military personnel must live in a manner consistent with the Articles of Faith.

I admonish you to read David K. Bernard's book, Practical Holiness a Second Look, where he goes into greater depth on the subject and clarifies why this is the Biblical position on warfare.

Essentially the conflict is between a teaching which is Pentecostal and of Holy Ghost origin and a teaching rooted in Reformed Presbyterianism.

I'm being challenged on account of holding a distinctly "Pentecostal" position.

ChristopherHall · #**523** 03-25-2008, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReformedDave

That's why I don't discuss the trinity or predestination......at least here.

Who should one believe....David K. Bernard...a man full of the Holy Ghost who has been water baptized in Jesus name and knows the Oneness of God? Or you?

ChristopherHall · #**524** 03-25-2008, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeanie

Chris if you are answering the posts so quickly how can you be reflective and possibly be taking in what is being said to you?

That goes both ways! LOL

ChristopherHall · #**525** 03-25-2008, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

So you compare the lives of innocent women and children to sin???

Chris, I hope you can do better than that.

Typology. Like little foxes.

ChristopherHall · #**526** 03-25-2008, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

Chris, let's stay on track here. This thread is about the words of Obama's pastor. His words have nothing to do with Christian nation worship, nor doctrinal issues. THAT is the point here, not the rabbit trails you keep steering into.

And I knew that Rico wasn't talking about what you were. He was too simple and to the point. You are about more than that.

But the question is...was Obama's pastor making some valid points regarding America's embrace of warfare and the slaughter of innocents...especially among professed Christians?

ChristopherHall · #**527** 03-25-2008, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

Another 'gut feeling'?

LOL!

David K. Bernard is born again of the water and the Spirit. ReformedDave is...well...is a work in progress. LOL

ChristopherHall · #**528** 03-25-2008, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

Chris, it doesnt matter if you agree or not. His right. You're wrong.

Have you read any of Bernard's work on the subject? Do you know the Articles of Faith of the UPCI? Did you know Pentecostal churches began issuing minister's licenses on the grounds of providing grounds for consciencious objector status? There is quite a bit of this in our foundational history. Only since the advent of the right wing dominionists have we seen a departure from the classical doctrine of Scripture on the matter.