They aren't required NOW to come out of the closet. They have the right to serve so long as they don't OUT themselves causing it to reach "command level" where it has to be addressed. I know the terminology isn't familiar, and that's also part of the problem. The military environment is unlike ANY civilian one. Civilians (especially the the thought/PC police) just don't understand how many issues repealing DADT will have.
We all have a right to privacy to a degree. If a person is openly gay however, and is allowed to serve and live in a communal environment, it will obviously be KNOWN. Most barracks I've been in contain multi-person rooms. It's not like you get your own personal apartment.
DADT repeal will require straights to be uncomfortably close in working and sleeping arrangements that simply don't exist in the civilian world.
On a different track, the military's policies on "conduct detrimental to the service (to include sexual morality)" will have to be modified. Straights will be allowed to have their significant others/girlfriends/hookups in their rooms, showers, bunks, wherever, if gays are offered their own rooms to be housed together. The conduct standard has historically been applied to maintain a level of high morale among men and women that are in a live-in situations without sexual partners. In light of this, DADT repeal is a terrible idea.
Repealing DADT will absolutely create the need to have an open live in situation for every soldier by law, otherwise disparity exists between conduct standards required for gays vs straights.
You raise good points. Would love to hear someone who can rebut.
My point about "rights" is that since they aren't required now, and won't be required later, the only thing that would change is that they wouldn't be kicked out if they CHOSE to come out.
BTW, I have a military background and am also very familiar with the military lifestyle, and the world of the UCMJ.
How will their right change if DADT is repealed? They won't be REQUIRED to "come out of the closet."
And now you've reached a point I was trying to make the other day. Just because DADT is lifted does not mean that all gays will come out. I suspect a fair number of them will not because of various reasons.
Very few people know of my orientation. I don't tell because my personal life is of no concern to most people. If I sat in a pew beside you, you would have no clue that I am gay.
And now you've reached a point I was trying to make the other day. Just because DADT is lifted does not mean that all gays will come out. I suspect a fair number of them will not because of various reasons.
Very few people know of my orientation. I don't tell because my personal life is of no concern to most people. If I sat in a pew beside you, you would have no clue that I am gay.
Knowledge is power. It's a game-changer when people are "out." Can't you understand that? A man doesn't feel his privacy is invaded until he has knowledge of the man he shares a bunk with is attracted to other men.
I realized that I've worshiped with, shared hotel rooms and gone on long road trips with men who later in life "came out."
Uh... what about Freud taught has been discarded????? lol
He is the Father of Modern Psychology. Do you use the word "ego?" Yes, you are a Freudian, my friend.
And Freud's Early Childhood Development model is still WIDELY popular.
Freud's Psychosexual Stages of Development
You missed it.
Anna Freud his lesbian daughter was into childhood development.
The Sexual Enlightenment of Children (The Collected Papers of Sigmund Freud, The Sexual Enlightenment of Children) By Freud, Sigmund
He sure wasn't into Early Child development. Psychoanalysis is about the history of ones development and Freud thought the cures were by finding repressed memories.
Knowledge is power. It's a game-changer when people are "out." Can't you understand that? A man doesn't feel his privacy is invaded until he has knowledge of the man he shares a bunk with is attracted to other men.
I realized that I've worshiped with, shared hotel rooms and gone on long road trips with men who later in life "came out."
And now you've reached a point I was trying to make the other day. Just because DADT is lifted does not mean that all gays will come out. I suspect a fair number of them will not because of various reasons.
Very few people know of my orientation. I don't tell because my personal life is of no concern to most people. If I sat in a pew beside you, you would have no clue that I am gay.
And now you've reached a point I was trying to make the other day. Just because DADT is lifted does not mean that all gays will come out. I suspect a fair number of them will not because of various reasons.
Very few people know of my orientation. I don't tell because my personal life is of no concern to most people. If I sat in a pew beside you, you would have no clue that I am gay.
I need to point out one thing. You, along with others, are lumping gay men and gay women into one group. Bad assumption. So your conclusion really should be: "the military will have to create barracks and showers for straight men, women and gay men and women". In other words not three seperate units but four.
You, along with others, are lumping gay men and gay women into one group.
And your point is what, exactly? My point is disparity of treatment. You will have to have single shower stalls built with room for ONE person for gays, men OR women. Right now, as it has been for YEARS gays serve in the military, and what they DO ON THEIR OWN TIME IS THEIR OWN BUSINESS AS LONG as long as they don't "out" themselves! Presently there are protocols concerning "immoral" sexual behavior in the regulations that prevent heteros (and that infers by definition everyone in the military) from whatever they want to do sexually. These regs will be irrelevant if gays are allowed to be open in their sexuality. I think it's pretty plain to see.
Incidently, I've known as many lesbians in the military as male gays...and they were much less self-conscious about being "known" than the males. So how does the military deal with it?
Have you served in the military, Azzan?
I see nothing but civil lawsuits coming over DADT repeal. The military environment is so PC now that officers rating an outed muslim would not report him to his supervisors. Ft Hood had a shooter as a result. I'm not equating gays to muslims but pointing out the PC environment facing the military now. The victims will be the straights that are either afraid of having their career destroyed by a bad rating due to PC.
You raise good points. Would love to hear someone who can rebut.
My point about "rights" is that since they aren't required now, and won't be required later, the only thing that would change is that they wouldn't be kicked out if they CHOSE to come out.
BTW, I have a military background and am also very familiar with the military lifestyle, and the world of the UCMJ.
DADT is back on the law. The 9th court let it back in place. If the ones that took federal dollars were kicked out for coming "out" now they have to pay back their education. In my opinion, civil courts are not the place for an non civilian problem.
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