Why I Am A Futurist

[mfblume]

i'm kind of stuck in a circle at

A&E were told, commanded not to eat of the tree of KGE; but they had no knowledge of good and evil, and so would inevitably eat of that tree sooner or later, anyway.
(a toddler is going to burn themselves, no matter how strong a caution you give them, because 'burn' has no meaning to them)

God, being omniscient, knew this; so the Fall was part of the plan.

also, reflect upon our conception of the Garden of Eden; that idyllic place, paradise, where nothing can go wrong, unless you do that one evil thing. Fair enough; but the concept of 'satan' never seems to be carried with it! Not even in my mind; "Garden of Eden" is a metaphor for "heaven on earth" to my brain, and satan is an anomaly there? So, we say "garden of eden" like a cliche`, and no one ever remarks on the serpent within.

I cannot agree due to concepts I currently hold, which may or may not be correct, that the fall was part of the plan. I see the fruit of life as putting God's life in man and putting him beyond the scope of satan's opportunity to tempt and influence.

That should answer the rest. Let me know, though.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by mfblume

In other words, the way I see it is that man would have never sinned to begin with had he eaten of the fruit of life.

ok, let's take a look at this. you imply that satan--an anomaly in our cliche` of Garden of Eden--had to entice Eve to eat of the bad fruit before she contemplated eating the good, from the tree of life, is this correct?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by shazeep

ok, let's take a look at this. you imply that satan--an anomaly in our cliche` of Garden of Eden--had to entice Eve to eat of the bad fruit before she contemplated eating the good, from the tree of life, is this correct?

I think he enticed her to eat so she'd eat it before she ate the fruit of life. Basically, yes.

Adam would multiply through her. God wanted them to multiply and fill the earth with themselves. Through children. And mankind with God's life in them, filling the earth, would manifest God everywhere. Satan would be thrown out of earth as he was from heaven. And of course he wanted rule of the world which Adam eventually abdicated to him.

So the enemy went after the woman first.

The life was to be in them to manifest through them into the physical realm what God filled in heaven. Images of God on earth ruling earth as God ruled heaven. But ruling with God.

I think the key is to understand the principle of the kingdom today so we can get what it meant back then, because this is a restoration of what was forfeited then.

Everywhere we read JESUS bringing life, and we read of the Pharisees and their legalism that was the greatest threat to people receiving that life. That's the basic principle in the garden.

[Esaias]

What is "knowledge of good and evil"?

Did they not already know good (do what God said) and evil (disobey God)?

After eating their eyes were "opened" and they saw they were naked.

Could it be the "knowledge of good and evil" was not so much a "sudden intellectual understanding of morals and ethics" but rather a LIFE of experiencing "good and evil"... which began with their shame at being naked, trying to cover themselves, hiding from God, etc?

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by Esaias

What is "knowledge of good and evil"?
Did they not already know good (do what God said) and evil (disobey God)?
After eating their eyes were "opened" and they saw they were naked.
Could it be the "knowledge of good and evil" was not so much a "sudden intellectual understanding of morals and ethics" but rather a LIFE of experiencing "good and evil"... which began with their shame at being naked, trying to cover themselves, hiding from God, etc?

What has been God's will: to have a holy seed (sons and
daughters) to Himself.

Satan's plan has always been to foil God's plan by corrupting
the seed. (1) Satan tempted the woman, who gave
man of the forbidden fruit; (2) the sons of God were
again tempted, and "...saw the daughters of men...and they
took them wives..."; (3) Balaam told Balak how to curse
God's chosen; by offering them wives from among Balak's people;
and (4) it finally affected the Church, to whom the Lord said,
"...because you are neither hot nor cold...lukewarm...I
will spew you out of my mouth...".

The "...knowledge of good and evil..." is mixing the
things that are holy with the things that are not.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Esaias

What is "knowledge of good and evil"?

Did they not already know good (do what God said) and evil (disobey God)?

After eating their eyes were "opened" and they saw they were naked.

Could it be the "knowledge of good and evil" was not so much a "sudden intellectual understanding of morals and ethics" but rather a LIFE of experiencing "good and evil"... which began with their shame at being naked, trying to cover themselves, hiding from God, etc?

It's a fruit that brought Adam and Eve into accountability. Where as we are born innocent and grow and eventually come to the age of accountability, they did it in one fell swoop. imo

[mfblume]

All the elements in genesis and the garden are in revelation. We have to read it with that in Mind. Only by comparing bible with bible will we get the truth.

[thephnxman]

Originally Posted by mfblume

All the elements in genesis and the garden are in revelation. We have to read it with that in Mind. Only by comparing bible with bible will we get the truth.

If a man can understand the first three chapters
of Genesis, he will understand much of the Bible.

[mfblume]

Not sure if I mentioned this or not, so disregard if I did.

I wrote a book based on the concept of some parallels I saw in Genesis and Revelation. Take a Bite of Eternal Life.

John saw Heaven opened and we know it is the true holiest of holies according to Hebrews 9. No one could go to the throne and take the sealed book. Just like no one could enter the holiest, except one. The High Priest. Jesus goes in as high priest, takes the sealed book and we read people are redeemed as a result.

I believe Revelation 4-5 is a spiritual symbolic picture of what happened after Christ resurrected when He made atonement. That's why He's a lamb having been slain but standing. Resurrected.

The lion, ox, eagle and man -- living creatures in Ezekiel, beasts in revelation 4:7, stand for mankind. They cried they were redeemed by the blood, and we know animals and angels are not redeemed. Rev 5:9-10. Their images were on the four banners of Israel's four tribes that were around the four compass points of the tabernacle. Dan=eagle. man=Reuben. Ox=Ephraim. Lion =Judah. Three of all twelve tribes assembled and camped under one of the four banners. Numbers 2.

So they stand for God's people.

And taking the sealed book from the hand of God was like Adam plucking fruit from the tree of life, had he obeyed God. Jesus is last man Adam.

And the four beasts that were by the sea of glass that blocked access before the throne were like the cherubims on the veil blocked access before the mercyseat of the ark. (Two more cherubims were on the mercyseat itself). And cherubims also blocked access to the Garden's tree of life.

So, the picture is Jesus doing what Adam should have done.

And Jesus gave the sealed book that He opened to John in Revelation 10 to eat, like it was fruit of life. THE WORD is eternal LIFE.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by thephnxman

If a man can understand the first three chapters
of Genesis, he will understand much of the Bible.

Exactly. It's been called the seabed of the bible with harvest reaped in Revelation.