The Second Coming of Christ

bbyrd009 · #1 01-22-2012, 03:40 PM

Is Christ's second coming an event in Revelations that will occur sometime in the future, for you? Why? i'd like to invite you to read everything you know about this concept with a different set of eyes; Christ comes when the bride, that's you, is prepared.

Jay · #2 01-23-2012, 01:32 AM

I know that it was not necessarily intended the way that I took it, but I have to agree with Bucky whole heartedly on this one. Of course, you can not have the one without the other.

The Bride of Christ is the church through the ages. He is coming to fetch her, and when He does, it will be as described in the Bible.

bbyrd009 · #3 01-23-2012, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay

I know that it was not necessarily intended the way that I took it, but I have to agree with Bucky whole heartedly on this one. Of course, you can not have the one without the other.

The Bride of Christ is the church through the ages. He is coming to fetch her, and when He does, it will be as described in the Bible.

Amen; just like that. I would discourage any "mass" events that your or another's interpretation might have provided for you, though, as these are simply unsupported. See that "in a twinkling of an eye, everyone," commonly interpreted to mean "everyone at once," is not supported here, or anywhere else that I can find, in the Bible.

mfblume · #4 01-23-2012, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Amen; just like that. I would discourage any "mass" events that your or another's interpretation might have provided for you, though, as these are simply unsupported. See that "in a twinkling of an eye, everyone," commonly interpreted to mean "everyone at once," is not supported here, or anywhere else that I can find, in the Bible.

I disagree. The twinkling of an eye scenario is EVERYONE WHO IS SAVED will be resurrected at the same time. The context reads that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom, therefore flesh must be changed. And the change will occur at the same time. It says in 1 Cor 15:51-52 ....

...We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

"We" refers to al the saved people. And not everyone who is saved shall physically die. But everyone who is saved shall be physically changed in body. When will this change occur for everyone? "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: ". It is speaking about when everyone will be changed that was mentioned in verse 51. The reason not everyone will die is because some will still be alive when the Lord comes, and will be changed in BODY at that moment. And that is also when the dead shall have their bodies changed. Again, this change is required for the physical part of us to inherit the Kingdom, while our souls and spirits have been enjoying the KINGDOM since we first got saved.

So read it like this: "we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump." That means everyone at the same time ARE CHANGED, both dead and alive.

bbyrd009 · #5 01-23-2012, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

I disagree. The twinkling of an eye scenario is EVERYONE WHO IS SAVED will be resurrected at the same time. The context reads that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom, therefore flesh must be changed. And the change will occur at the same time. It says in 1 Cor 15:51-52 ....

...We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

"We" refers to al the saved people. And not everyone who is saved shall physically die. But everyone who is saved shall be physically changed in body. When will this change occur for everyone? "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: ". It is speaking about when everyone will be changed that was mentioned in verse 51. The reason not everyone will die is because some will still be alive when the Lord comes, and will be changed in BODY at that moment. And that is also when the dead shall have their bodies changed. Again, this change is required for the physical part of us to inherit the Kingdom, while our souls and spirits have been enjoying the KINGDOM since we first got saved.

So read it like this: "we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump." That means everyone at the same time ARE CHANGED, both dead and alive.

I might only take exception to the "at the same time" here, but feel that this is splitting hairs. I will say that your interpretation here strikes me as the common one, which makes me suspect it, that we have not maturely interpreted this yet, and still hear our version of "stay here for the present," possibly.

mfblume · #6 01-23-2012, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

I might only take exception to the "at the same time" here, but feel that this is splitting hairs. I will say that your interpretation here strikes me as the common one, which makes me suspect it, that we have not maturely interpreted this yet, and still hear our version of "stay here for the present," possibly.

Just because some thoughts are common does =not mean they are wrong. the ONLY way to analyse a passage is to carefully read the passage. There does not have to be a hidden meaning anywhere. Some common thoughts are wrong, and I can think of many. But I do not think so with this one.

The context says that not everyone will die, but everyone will be changed. And then it tells us when this will happen. In the twinkling of an eye at the last trump. Stop and consider what that means. If everyone will be changed whether they are dead or alive, how can it NOT be at the same moment?

It is not splitting hairs. It is a huge difference to believe he comes for each individual at a different time as opposed to coming for everyone all at once.

KeptByTheWord · #7 01-23-2012, 11:53 AM

Here's something I've heard recently. I don't know if it is splitting hairs or not.

But I think I agree with both BByrd009 and Bro. Blume.

I think what BB (shortened version of your name, if you don't mind... ) is trying to say that is Christ going to be manifested fully, and completely in each believers life at some point in time when God decides enough is enough, and the trumpet sounds. Then our physical bodies will be changed "in a twinkling of an eye" but instead of going somewhere supernatural... meaning outside of our present world... could it be... and this is my big question... could it be that we are changed from our physical bodies here to a spiritual body like Christ's, and be part of a changed immortal church group of people here on the new earth that God says he will be creating? I don't know. Nor does anyone really know for sure. But just a thought.

If we can believe that we will be changed, and taken out of this world, a big concept to grasp, why is it so unbelievable that it is also possible that we be supernaturally changed to stay here, in the new earth God will be creating... ????

The OT writings seem to point to the natural earth being recreated where the wolf will once again lay down with the lamb....

Isaiah 65:17-25 17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind. 18 But be ye glad and rejoice for ever [in that] which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.

19 And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying. 20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner [being] an hundred years old shall be accursed.

21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit [them]; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.

22 They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree [are] the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.23 They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they [are] the seed of the blessed of the LORD, and their offspring with them.

24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.

25 The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust [shall be] the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.

Sounds like a natural earth recreated to me, and perhaps our immortal spiritual bodies will dwell in this new earth.

I believe Revelation speaks of this also.

I am wondering if BB and Blume's thoughts could somehow both be right?

Scott Hutchinson · #8 01-23-2012, 12:26 PM

I'm far from being an expert,but I do believe in a general resurrection of the just and the unjust and a final appearing of Christ.

bbyrd009 · #9 01-23-2012, 12:31 PM

I must admit I agree with mfblume here, for the most part, and am tempted to see a mass occurrence here, at this special event in Rev, which may be just that; but I am too often led to a personal meaning to not be suspicious of a group translation.

bbyrd009 · #10 01-23-2012, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

I'm far from being an expert,but I do believe in a general resurrection of the just and the unjust and a final appearing of Christ.

Me, too, I just accept that my image of it, surely still pretty much the same as in the common mind, is naive.