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Old 04-12-2009, 09:09 AM
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What is postmodernism?

I've been trying to find an understandable definition of postmodernism, and I'm not having any luck.

Anyone care to try to explain it for me?
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Old 04-12-2009, 11:38 AM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

It's what comes after "Modernism."

Modernism was a rejection of the post Enlightenment period's view of the world. During the Enlightenment and the subsequent scientific and industrial revolutions the thinking that seemed to guide the times was that the universe was this huge machine that was orderly and predictable.

Modernism was an accomodation with reality. Schroendinger's Cat and Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle are the chief findings of Modernism and gave Post Modernism the slightest foothold in the arena of science.

Modernism was also something of a hopeful view that despite the uncertainties of the world and in each of our lives, we could still trust "the natural order" and (if you chose) the Creator of that "order" to see that things progressed along nicely. More or less nicely, all too often less.

World War One was the death knell for Modernism in Europe. In the States, we weren't satisfied until after the end of World War Two.
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Old 04-12-2009, 11:39 AM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

Post Modernism is primarily a literary and artistic reaction to the "naive" optimism of Modernism. Some will substitute more derogatory terms for "naive" such as "racist" and "homophobic" or "Eurocentric." In place of these "evils" they offer "Afro or Asiancentric" (or just about any place else) and "heterophobic" and ironically enough, just more plain old racism.

There is even a debate as to whether or not "Post Modernism" really exists. Not to fear however, as this sort of doubt and questioning is merely a reflection of post modernism itself. POMO (Post Modernism) is really a continuation on a theme that was first developed as a footnote to Rene Descartes' work.

Descartes was famous for the "I think, therefore I am" saying; despite the fact that he didn't quite say that. However, a student of his; known to history only as "Thomas," developed a line of thinking that produced the idea that doubt was the primary and fundamental ingredient to all thought.

The line goes like this: "Even if I doubt I exist; I must think those thoughts of doubt - and therefore I must exist." The whole thing was intended as a thought exercise designed to develop the most fundamental and basic statement from which to begin all philosophy.
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Old 04-12-2009, 11:39 AM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

Added to this were the enduring themes of Rousseau's Blank Slate and The Noble Savage. These two thoughts led inexorably to Freud's ideas that we're all messed up due to the overly rigorous demands of our toilet training and other "evils" of Western Civilization. Basically, we were all born into this world pure and unstained by any competitive thoughts or politically incorrect attitudes. Then, the evils of Western society bore upon us and molded us into the monsters that we are today.

All of society is a huge mistake. We should go back to running naked through the forests. This attitude of course ignores the fact that it is only safe to run naked through the forests today because Western society has hunted down and killed all of the cave bears, dire wolves and saber tooth cats.

Another major player in POMO thought was Derrida, who like his much earlier predecessor Descartes, was actually quite brilliant; but he too suffered from having sloppy devotees and so his ideas get a bad rap. He was the one who coined the whole "deconstruction" method. He also pointed out the major flaw in all human thoughts - "Binary Thinking." Unfortunately the beatniks all took to "deconstruction" and ignored his warnings about Binary Thinking. The results of this can be found in most of the media output that you see today.

In my view, we are thankfully coming out of this nonsense as academia is again arming itself with effective tools for discussing and examining ideas. One of the first signs of "revival" was (of all people) Noam Chomsky's work on "The Language Instinct" back in the 1950's. This seminal work established the idea that there was such a thing as human nature; that is - we are not slaves to the memories of the suffering and abuse we suffered during toilet training but that we can actually choose to be the kind (or nearly the kind) of person we desire to be. Chomsky proved that the "slate" was never really "blank."

A good anthem for the Post-Post Modern Movement is Steven Pinker's "How the Mind Works" and its follow up "The Blank Slate." If you're interested (and up to it) these are great reads. If you're only curious and wonder what I meant by "up to it" then "The Blank Slate" is the place to start.
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Old 04-12-2009, 12:01 PM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

I've been wrestling with the idea of what to call this new age of understanding. Since some homophobe in Europe coined the term "Modern" to describe what was happening 150 years ago and the follow up has been inevitibly called "Post Modernism," what's next?

The problem was that people thought they had really arrived back in the Victorian period. They thought they were the very height of morality and civilization. So they called themselves "Modern." Modern means "current," as in "right now." Problem is, every age was "modern" at the time.

When the Victorian colonial empires fell apart - due largely to the rampant immorality of the times; many folks in the West just sort of shrivelled up.

POMO tended to emphasize that diminution of the West and celebrated the "Noble Savages" who are now our masters. Unfortunately, the "savages" aren't always so "noble" and their savagery isn't always the result of their colonial administrations (which is viewed today as sort of a global version of Freud's toilet training).

Personally, I am some what positive about the future. I reject the dire notions of Dispensationalism, but I do recognize the cycle and pattern of the "Prophetic Cycle" as outlined in the history of Israel and the book of Revelation. So, there's always "judgment" right around the corner, but there's also forgiveness and renewal.

So, what do we call "tomorrow?" What do you call the day after Easter? Ironically, we are reintroduced to Thomas and his doubts all over again.
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Old 04-12-2009, 12:02 PM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

Quote:
Chomsky proved that the "slate" was never really "blank."
What do you mean by this, Pel? And how did Chomsky prove the slate was never really blank?

Are you saying human souls are eternal and have memories prior to our birth?
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Old 04-12-2009, 01:34 PM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh View Post
What do you mean by this, Pel? And how did Chomsky prove the slate was never really blank?

Are you saying human souls are eternal and have memories prior to our birth?
No. The "Blank Slate" was Jacques Rousseau's (1712-1778) idea of the "Tablet Rosa." In those days all school work was done on "slates" or mini chalk boards held by the individual student. To truly clean a slate from the wax-like "chalk" markings required scrubbing and scraping to clean the surface.

The "Tablet Rosa" means literally, "A scraped slate" or a clean slate.

Rousseau thought that all human beings come into the world with a "clean slate." This was his reaction against the Catholic Chrurch's teaching on original sin and the Protestant Evangelical teachings on Total Depravity. He rejected these ideas and offered the premise that all of us come into the world "pure" and "innocent."

It is the "modern" (for him "modern") State, Church and Society that has corrupted us all and made us into the uptight, fearful and emotional wrecks that we are.

Chomsky didn't really set out to establish anything about the "Tablet Rosa.' He was a linguist and psychologist who was looking at how human infants acquired the skill to use language. There had already been a number of studies done with "feral" humans - human beings who were raised in environments where they were deprived of the opportunity to learn language as small children. These people never did, and could not ever learn to speak. They had missed the only opportunity that humans have to acquire the ability.

It turns out, that there is a mechanism that works in our brains where we go through a period of development and our brains are literally "wired" to acquire speech when we are toddlers and infants. The implications of this discovery were far reaching. It turns out that our heads are "wired" or "preconfigured" to do a lot of things developmentally and throughout our lives.

In other words, we now have scientific data to support the idea that there is something we can call "human nature." In the very structure of our minds, there is something "inplanted" that influences who we are as individuals.

This starts out as a rather subtle point but its implications are huge to the POMO and "multi cultural" agenda. This also helps to explain why the Behavioralist movement (B.F. Skinner, Aldous Huxley etc.) never really succeeded and why socialism is doomed to fail as well.

We simply cannot be "programmed" into little robots. To try and do so leads to a violent opposition that is rooted in the very fabric of who we are as human beings.
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Old 04-12-2009, 02:35 PM
mizpeh mizpeh is offline
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Re: What is postmodernism?

I'm not putting 2 and 2 together here. I would agree with Rousseau's thought that we are not born with original sin or in total depravity. The Bible teaches we come to an age when we know between good and evil. Until that time we are innocents like Adam and Eve were before they took of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

I'm not sure you answered my question about Chomsky. How did he prove the slate was not clean? Do you think the mind is the same as the brain? are you using those words interchangably?
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Old 04-12-2009, 02:44 PM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

That's all well and good. But. Just stay away from those vampires!
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Old 04-12-2009, 03:32 PM
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Re: What is postmodernism?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mizpeh View Post
I'm not putting 2 and 2 together here. I would agree with Rousseau's thought that we are not born with original sin or in total depravity. The Bible teaches we come to an age when we know between good and evil. Until that time we are innocents like Adam and Eve were before they took of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

I'm not sure you answered my question about Chomsky. How did he prove the slate was not clean? Do you think the mind is the same as the brain? are you using those words interchangably?
What I'm getting from this, and Pel can say if I'm correct or not, is that we're not born into this world as completely empty vessels, that will be completely and totally formed by our upbringing. We are greatly influenced by our upbringing, but there are some things that are already programmed into human nature.

I think this is exhibited by the fact that a child who is adopted can have some of the traits of his biological parents, even if he's never met them.

Am I way off base, Pel?
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