I refuse to remove the landmarks

[YEPhesMycousin]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Jesus said, "According to your faith so be it unto you."

I sincerely believe that we often place our faith on various things. Sometimes those are external standards. If our faith is rooted in these things due to teaching or personal conviction from self study, one can loose their anointing if their own heart begins to condemn them for what they've done...even if it's not a sin. Many who have studied the occult can tell you that witches also believe that spiritual anointing, or power, is in the hair...they often wear their hair long, straight, and uncut. In fact sometimes it's used in pagan rituals. They also wear long skirts and maintain a "natural" appearance. For example:

http://www.ahighersourcesupply.com/images/julia4.jpg

These witches often claim that their "anointing" wanes if their hair is cut or their appearance isn't all "natural". Here's a disturbing thought...what if some of our "Pentecostal" traditions are mistaken encroachments of witchcraft? We base much of our faith on them, and naturally if they are interfered with our faith is cut short...and the resulting lack of faith brings lack of anointing?

I knew a man who sincerely believed that he shouldn't read National Geographic Magazine because of some of the pictures depicting tribal women in what we Westerners would consider unclothed. Well, one day he picked one up in a doctor's office and read an article about Tsunamis. Later that evening at church he was called on to lead prayer. His prayer was unsteady, broken, and un-anointed. He confessed to me that it was because he had read a National Geographic. I laughed and then he got VERY serious with me. I couldn't believe my ears...he actually believed that he had lost anointing because he read a National Geo. I looked at him thinking, "It's because your own heart is condemning you and weakening your faith."

Oh well...I'm sure you get the picture. I could be wrong. Just sharing some thoughts.

Sir, DO NOT TRY TO TELL ME THAT MY TESTIMONY IS UNTRUE!!!!!!!!! I knew from watching this forum that if I shared a personal testimony someone would try to say that what I experienced didn't really happen.

IF you want to state what else you wrote, fine. Leave my testimony out of it.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by YEPhesMycousin

Sir, DO NOT TRY TO TELL ME THAT MY TESTIMONY IS UNTRUE!!!!!!!!! I knew from watching this forum that if I shared a personal testimony someone would try to say that what I experienced didn't really happen.

IF you want to state what else you wrote, fine. Leave my testimony out of it.

If you read my post I said something very important....

Oh well...I'm sure you get the picture. I could be wrong. Just sharing some thoughts.

I was just sharing my thoughts. Please don't be so defensive. If a testimony is true, it will stand regardless of my thoughts or questions.

Here's my testimony... we attended a church that believed in uncut hair having anointing and my wife didn't cut her hair for 12 years. After much study and prayer she began to feel like it was dangerously close to witchcraft and like was distracting her from placing her faith in Christ. She became increasingly disturbed because of this and it was like she was wearing her religion on her sleeve. Not to mention most just viewed her as being part of a cult and it broke her heart how every witness she shared would suddenly move from discussing Jesus to discussing her "standards". It was a difficult realization for her.

Just sharing a personal testimony from my family.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Jesus said, "According to your faith so be it unto you."

I sincerely believe that we often place our faith on various things. Sometimes those are external standards. If our faith is rooted in these things due to teaching or personal conviction from self study, one can loose their anointing if their own heart begins to condemn them for what they've done...even if it's not a sin. Many who have studied the occult can tell you that witches also believe that spiritual anointing, or power, is in their hair...they often wear their hair long, straight, and uncut. In fact sometimes it's used in pagan rituals. They also wear long skirts and maintain a "natural" appearance. For example:

http://www.ahighersourcesupply.com/images/julia4.jpg

These witches often claim that their "anointing" wanes if their hair is cut or their appearance isn't all "natural". Here's a disturbing thought...what if some of our "Pentecostal traditions" are mistaken encroachments of witchcraft? We base much of our faith on them, and naturally if they are interfered with our faith is cut short...and the resulting lack of faith would bring lack of anointing.

I knew a man who sincerely believed that he shouldn't read National Geographic Magazine because of some of the pictures depicting unclothed tribal women. Well, one day he picked one up in a doctor's office and read an article about Tsunamis. Later that evening at church he was called on to lead prayer. His prayer was unsteady, broken, and un-anointed. He confessed to me that it was because he had read a National Geographic. I laughed and then he got VERY serious with me. I couldn't believe my ears...he actually believed that he had lost anointing because he read a National Geo. I looked at him thinking, "It's because your own heart is condemning you and weakening your faith." Is faith was in his performance and not in Jesus. If we put our faith in our appearance and not in Jesus...if that appearance doesn't line up...we loose faith and anointing.

Oh well...I'm sure you get the picture. I could be wrong. Just sharing some thoughts.

If our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart.
God may convict us but He will not condemn us.
Because we "feel" condemned by something does not mean that something is wrong. We are to go by the Word, not by our feelings. I just read a note I had written in my Bible next to 1 John 5:10-13:
D.L. Moody (1837-1899) said, "I believe hundreds of Christians are being deceived by satan now on this point. They don't have the assurance of salvation just because they are not willing to take God at His Word."

A former pastor of mine (who was UPC District Superintendent of Ohio) told us a story about when he was young. He was going to a Nazarene Church which preached strict adherence to "rules." They taught that we under the New Testament were supposed to obey certain parts of the Old Testament law such as the 10 commandments, but they taught that Sunday was now the sabbath. Since Sunday was the sabbath it was a sin to do any work on the sabbath and a sin to pay someone else to work on the sabbath so paying for a bus ride or buying anything on Sunday was wrong. He was going to a storefront church. One Sunday he and a friend were looking at a large pulpit Bible in their church. It was open to a passage in Hebrews and was marked about committing the "unpardonable" sin. It was a very hot day and they had quite a distance to walk to get home. It would have been a sin to ride a bus because they would be paying someone to work and causing that person to sin. So they walked the long distance toward home. Of course they were dressed in clothes that did not make the journey any easier. Finally, in desperation they stopped at a store that was open and bought an ice cream cone --a sin because they were paying someone to desecrate the sabbath by working. As soon as he took that first lick of ice cream he became very "convicted" and realized he had committed the "unpardonable sin." Now where did that "conviction" or "condemnation" come from?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Sam

If our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart.
God may convict us but He will not condemn us.
Because we "feel" condemned by something does not mean that something is wrong. We are to go by the Word, not by our feelings. I just read a note I had written in my Bible next to 1 John 5:10-13:
D.L. Moody (1837-1899) said, "I believe hundreds of Christians are being deceived by satan now on this point. They don't have the assurance of salvation just because they are not willing to take God at His Word."

A former pastor of mine (who was UPC District Superintendent of Ohio) told us a story about when he was young. He was going to a Nazarene Church which preached strict adherence to "rules." They taught that we under the New Testament were supposed to obey certain parts of the Old Testament law such as the 10 commandments, but they taught that Sunday was now the sabbath. Since Sunday was the sabbath it was a sin to do any work on the sabbath and a sin to pay someone else to work on the sabbath so paying for a bus ride or buying anything on Sunday was wrong. He was going to a storefront church. One Sunday he and a friend were looking at a large pulpit Bible in their church. It was open to a passage in Hebrews and was marked about committing the "unpardonable" sin. It was a very hot day and they had quite a distance to walk to get home. It would have been a sin to ride a bus because they would be paying someone to work and causing that person to sin. So they walked the long distance toward home. Of course they were dressed in clothes that did not make the journey any easier. Finally, in desperation they stopped at a store that was open and bought an ice cream cone --a sin because they were paying someone to desecrate the sabbath by working. As soon as he took that first lick of ice cream he became very "convicted" and realized he had committed the "unpardonable sin." Now where did that "conviction" or "condemnation" come from?

Legalism can crush a person's faith in Christ. I know people who couldn't "measure up" though they never outright "sinned" a sin worthy of being biblically disfellowshipped. These individuals still feel that God still can't love them because of some artificial "standard", based on man's traditions, that's been drilled into their heads. I know an older woman who has chalked herself up to being lost because she owns a television. She lives alone and once told me that if not for the television she could easily go a couple days without hearing another person's voice or seeing another person's face. Her eyes aren't what they used to be and reading is difficult. She doesn't have cable and she only has basic channels. She has had it drilled into her head that she can't be saved and own a television. She's in her late 70's and she doesn't find anything carnal all that interesting. She has had it drilled into her head that she can't be saved and own a television. And she firmly believes she can't go to church because they will not accept her unless she gives it up.

Often those "in church" base their relationship with Christ on their performance regarding their standards...thereby sometimes missing a real relationship with Jesus himself.

Legalism can be far more than just outdated traditions and customs. Legalism can be spiritually deadly.

Matthew 23:13
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Sam

If our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart.
God may convict us but He will not condemn us.
Because we "feel" condemned by something does not mean that something is wrong. We are to go by the Word, not by our feelings. I just read a note I had written in my Bible next to 1 John 5:10-13:
D.L. Moody (1837-1899) said, "I believe hundreds of Christians are being deceived by satan now on this point. They don't have the assurance of salvation just because they are not willing to take God at His Word."

A former pastor of mine (who was UPC District Superintendent of Ohio) told us a story about when he was young. He was going to a Nazarene Church which preached strict adherence to "rules." They taught that we under the New Testament were supposed to obey certain parts of the Old Testament law such as the 10 commandments, but they taught that Sunday was now the sabbath. Since Sunday was the sabbath it was a sin to do any work on the sabbath and a sin to pay someone else to work on the sabbath so paying for a bus ride or buying anything on Sunday was wrong. He was going to a storefront church. One Sunday he and a friend were looking at a large pulpit Bible in their church. It was open to a passage in Hebrews and was marked about committing the "unpardonable" sin. It was a very hot day and they had quite a distance to walk to get home. It would have been a sin to ride a bus because they would be paying someone to work and causing that person to sin. So they walked the long distance toward home. Of course they were dressed in clothes that did not make the journey any easier. Finally, in desperation they stopped at a store that was open and bought an ice cream cone --a sin because they were paying someone to desecrate the sabbath by working. As soon as he took that first lick of ice cream he became very "convicted" and realized he had committed the "unpardonable sin." Now where did that "conviction" or "condemnation" come from?

Sam, I believe God wants us to honor them that have the rule over us and submit unto them as they that watch for our souls. Now if a pastor has a conviction that we should not eat meat and preaches that conviction as a rule for the whole entire body of believers to follow, as long as a saint is under this person's rule, I believe they should honor their pastor's rule in not eating meat EVEN if it is not their conviction. I think the saint who dishonors the pastors rule, even though they disagree, is being dishonoring God as well. Sometimes we have to submit and do things we are not convicted of God to do to be united in the Spirit though maybe not in the faith. It's the attitude of humility, willingness to be peaceable, working together for unity that I believe pleases God.

How much can we put ourselves out to live in unity with others who we love but may not agree with every place they put the jot and tittle before we seek another church to fellowship with is another story.

[RandyWayne]

I wear cloths.



Sometimes.

[RandyWayne]

Seriously though, I hope that you pick up one VERY important fact as a result of this thread you started.....

.....you weren't banned for starting it!

Now if "I" went onto a conservative apostolic board and dared question some "old landmark" (circa, 1950's) "standard", I would be corrected, chastised, and subsequently banned in rapid order.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Seriously though, I hope that you pick up one VERY important fact as a result of this thread you started.....

.....you weren't banned for starting it!

Now if "I" went onto a conservative apostolic board and dared question some "old landmark" (circa, 1950's) "standard", I would be corrected, chastised, and subsequently banned in rapid order.

That's an important point. The things that are truly eternal will always stand.

Those things that won't even stand still and be questioned will not last.

[Theophil]

Originally Posted by pelathais

that's an important point. The things that are truly eternal will always stand.

those things that won't even stand still and be questioned will not last.

exactly my point!

[LadyChocolate]

would this guy be another 'terry g' ? Hmmm