Just Some Things I've Been Holding In

[bbyrd009]

"I see how it is, you start a thread that creates a hornets nest and you are off being just fine . . ."

Lol. My future advice for depressives will be a finger.
Depression is a spirit that one makes a home for. Period.

[KeptByTheWord]

Glad to hear you are doing better Matt!

[KeptByTheWord]

ILG, I have pondered whether to say this or not, but I guess I will. It's late, and I need to go to bed... but anyway, I consider you to be a friend since hanging out here on AFF, and I always enjoy your posts.

I realize that you are speaking through a tremendous amount of pain, and it is easy for others to either pat you on the back, or as you say, pick up a bat and beat you to death, without ever having walked in your shoes, or dealt with the things you have had to deal with.

Speaking from my own personal experience, having been dealt the heavy hand from the ministry myself, and with my family still going through abuse at the hands of the ministry, let me say, that I do understand how wretched your soul feels after walking through this valley of affliction.

But... when I began to read Psalms after going through these things, I understood that David was hunted by someone who should have appreciated the ministry and the work that he had done for him. After all, wasn't David the one who sang and ministered to Saul when Saul had a bad day. It seems that Saul should have appreciated David for saving the entire nation of Israel from the hands of Goliath too. The list goes on and on... from Saul turning against him, to his own son Absolom ... and David writes about this in Psalms 41:9 "Yea, mine own familiar friend, in whom I trusted, which did eat of my bread, hath lifted up his heel against me".

You see, the greatest hurts do come from the very people that should be looking out after our best interests, our friends, family, loved ones, those in the ministry... yet they are the very ones who hurt us the most, and most deeply.

You have been hurt so very deeply. I know that, and the wounds and scars are still there to prove it.

Yet, it is my sincere, humble opinion that unless you bring yourself to completely, totally, and deeply let go of those hurts and wounds, and lay them on the altar, under the blood, and let healing forgiveness flow in your spirit, these wounds will never heal.

That is why I wrote in an earlier post on this thread, that until I was able to truly get down on my knees, and as hard as it was, to begin to ask God to BLESS those who had hurt me, to forgive them, and to help me forgive them, it was not until that point, that I began to see a change in my life and heart. Praying for the Lord to bless someone who had been such a cruel and evil man in so many ways was sickeningly hard to do... at first. But I did do it, and continued even though sometimes my heart wasn't quite there. But one day, I began to notice that as I prayed, those old feelings of bitterness and anger weren't there, and I genuinely was asking the Lord to bring about good things in this man's life.

I am saying this to you because I feel your pain, and your heart is bleeding still from these wounds, but it doesn't have to. There is healing, in the blood of Jesus there still flows a fountain of forgiveness that is much greater than any vengenance or recompense that we could desire to see happen.

And for the record, all the things that have happened to my family, they are still ongoing. There are still times, even quite recently, as in last month... when the old wounds reopen, when I hear new horror stories, and I wonder why... when Lord???? When will all this stop? When? How long? It has been 45 years already that this man has carried on like this... isn't that long enough????

The Lord showed me that the wheat and the tares will be taken up together. Tough lesson to handle. The wicked seem to prosper and get by for now. But not for eternity. So I keep that in mind when the wounds want to open back up, and the temptation for bitterness and anger show up. I have to give it back to the Lord, and let Him carry out the judgment when His time is right.

I read Corrie Ten Boom's book, the Hiding Place, and also some other books that she wrote. She found it very hard to forgive the very ones who had tortured her in the prison camps. She met up with one of the guards later in her life. She had just preached a message of forgiveness. Then, as she was leaving the platform, she was faced with a test of that forgiveness, because there in front of her was the very guard who had tortured and demeaned and even perhaps caused the death of her dear sister. Old feelings of hate, and horror rose up in her like bile in her mouth. The guard stuck out his hand to her, and said, Corrie, will you forgive me. She said that she struggled within her heart for a long moment, and closed her eyes, and said, Lord, I can't forgive this man. And the Lord spoke to her, and said, YOU can't, but I can. Corrie said she was able to open her eyes, look that guard straight in the eye, and tell him she had forgiven him, but she knew, SHE had not done the work, the Lord Jesus had.

This story spoke to me so strongly, and I can't get it out of my mind. If she could forgive a man who had caused such terrible things to happen to her, I have no choice but to believe that the Lord will help me forgive those who have hurt me.

Now, I know your analogy about being run over by a truck is true. There are injuries and wounds caused that may never completely heal. Yet, if we believe that the shed blood of Jesus is able to remit any sins we have sinned, surely we can believe that the work on Calvary is able to allow a complete work of healing in our lives to take place through forgiveness. I believe it is true, for I have experienced it myself.

Just try it, ILG, just try praying, truly praying for those who have hurt you, and see if the Lord doesn't do the healing work in your life that you desire.

You are gifted, talented and your true spirit shines in so many ways here on the forum. I believe the Lord is wanting to open a new chapter in your life, a new door to walk for you to walk through.

As a fellow sister in Christ, I humbly share the above, believing above all in a Saviour who can heal, not just our bodies, but our hearts and He can restore far more, above and beyond what you can see with your natural eyes.

Praying for you about all this, my friend :hugs

[CC1]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

ILG, I have pondered whether to say this or not, but I guess I will. It's late, and I need to go to bed... but anyway, I consider you to be a friend since hanging out here on AFF, and I always enjoy your posts.

I realize that you are speaking through a tremendous amount of pain, and it is easy for others to either pat you on the back, or as you say, pick up a bat and beat you to death, without ever having walked in your shoes, or dealt with the things you have had to deal with.

Speaking from my own personal experience, having been dealt the heavy hand from the ministry myself, and with my family still going through abuse at the hands of the ministry, let me say, that I do understand how wretched your soul feels after walking through this valley of affliction.

But... when I began to read Psalms after going through these things, I understood that David was hunted by someone who should have appreciated the ministry and the work that he had done for him. After all, wasn't David the one who sang and ministered to Saul when Saul had a bad day. It seems that Saul should have appreciated David for saving the entire nation of Israel from the hands of Goliath too. The list goes on and on... from Saul turning against him, to his own son Absolom ... and David writes about this in Psalms 41:9 "Yea, mine own familiar friend, in whom I trusted, which did eat of my bread, hath lifted up his heel against me".

You see, the greatest hurts do come from the very people that should be looking out after our best interests, our friends, family, loved ones, those in the ministry... yet they are the very ones who hurt us the most, and most deeply.

You have been hurt so very deeply. I know that, and the wounds and scars are still there to prove it.

Yet, it is my sincere, humble opinion that unless you bring yourself to completely, totally, and deeply let go of those hurts and wounds, and lay them on the altar, under the blood, and let healing forgiveness flow in your spirit, these wounds will never heal.

That is why I wrote in an earlier post on this thread, that until I was able to truly get down on my knees, and as hard as it was, to begin to ask God to BLESS those who had hurt me, to forgive them, and to help me forgive them, it was not until that point, that I began to see a change in my life and heart. Praying for the Lord to bless someone who had been such a cruel and evil man in so many ways was sickeningly hard to do... at first. But I did do it, and continued even though sometimes my heart wasn't quite there. But one day, I began to notice that as I prayed, those old feelings of bitterness and anger weren't there, and I genuinely was asking the Lord to bring about good things in this man's life.

I am saying this to you because I feel your pain, and your heart is bleeding still from these wounds, but it doesn't have to. There is healing, in the blood of Jesus there still flows a fountain of forgiveness that is much greater than any vengenance or recompense that we could desire to see happen.

And for the record, all the things that have happened to my family, they are still ongoing. There are still times, even quite recently, as in last month... when the old wounds reopen, when I hear new horror stories, and I wonder why... when Lord???? When will all this stop? When? How long? It has been 45 years already that this man has carried on like this... isn't that long enough????

The Lord showed me that the wheat and the tares will be taken up together. Tough lesson to handle. The wicked seem to prosper and get by for now. But not for eternity. So I keep that in mind when the wounds want to open back up, and the temptation for bitterness and anger show up. I have to give it back to the Lord, and let Him carry out the judgment when His time is right.

I read Corrie Ten Boom's book, the Hiding Place, and also some other books that she wrote. She found it very hard to forgive the very ones who had tortured her in the prison camps. She met up with one of the guards later in her life. She had just preached a message of forgiveness. Then, as she was leaving the platform, she was faced with a test of that forgiveness, because there in front of her was the very guard who had tortured and demeaned and even perhaps caused the death of her dear sister. Old feelings of hate, and horror rose up in her like bile in her mouth. The guard stuck out his hand to her, and said, Corrie, will you forgive me. She said that she struggled within her heart for a long moment, and closed her eyes, and said, Lord, I can't forgive this man. And the Lord spoke to her, and said, YOU can't, but I can. Corrie said she was able to open her eyes, look that guard straight in the eye, and tell him she had forgiven him, but she knew, SHE had not done the work, the Lord Jesus had.

This story spoke to me so strongly, and I can't get it out of my mind. If she could forgive a man who had caused such terrible things to happen to her, I have no choice but to believe that the Lord will help me forgive those who have hurt me.

Now, I know your analogy about being run over by a truck is true. There are injuries and wounds caused that may never completely heal. Yet, if we believe that the shed blood of Jesus is able to remit any sins we have sinned, surely we can believe that the work on Calvary is able to allow a complete work of healing in our lives to take place through forgiveness. I believe it is true, for I have experienced it myself.

Just try it, ILG, just try praying, truly praying for those who have hurt you, and see if the Lord doesn't do the healing work in your life that you desire.

You are gifted, talented and your true spirit shines in so many ways here on the forum. I believe the Lord is wanting to open a new chapter in your life, a new door to walk for you to walk through.

As a fellow sister in Christ, I humbly share the above, believing above all in a Saviour who can heal, not just our bodies, but our hearts and He can restore far more, above and beyond what you can see with your natural eyes.

Praying for you about all this, my friend :hugs

Beautiful post that I think will minister to a lot of people.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Just try it, ILG, just try praying, truly praying for those who have hurt you, and see if the Lord doesn't do the healing work in your life that you desire.

You are gifted, talented and your true spirit shines in so many ways here on the forum. I believe the Lord is wanting to open a new chapter in your life, a new door to walk for you to walk through.

As a fellow sister in Christ, I humbly share the above, believing above all in a Saviour who can heal, not just our bodies, but our hearts and He can restore far more, above and beyond what you can see with your natural eyes.

Praying for you about all this, my friend :hugs

I appreciate what you wrote very much. It is very nice. That said, please don't assume that I have not prayed for those who hurt me. Actually, I don't hold much malice towards them. I hold some resentment but for the most part, it is let go. People also assume that because I am not attending church that I must still have gaping open wounds. I lay in bed last night and this allegory came to mind:

The Indian Brave

There once was an Indian Brave who was part of a tribe who valued horse riding very highly. He was not originally part of this tribe, but of another, whose parents gave him and untrained, wild horse. He fell off of this horse a number of times and healed and got back on only to be thrown again and again. He decided to become part of another tribe that he felt would give him a better horse. This tribe seemed very regal and strong. He was angry that he was given a wild, untrained horse when he was so young and felt he should have been started out on a better trained horse. He did ache in some spots, but he would find a better horse and be part of a better tribe. He was still young.

This tribe criticized his parents and his old tribe telling him that they never should have given him that wild horse at such a young age. He began to trust this tribe because they said all the right things. This tribe did not give him a horse but he had to earn his own. When he finally got his horse, after much fanfare by the elders about how well trained and wonderful this horse was, he found this horse to be very wild as well, but he trusted the elders and when he fell off the horse, he blamed himself. This happened over and over again. He could see the horse was wild. Others from his old tribe told him the elders were taking advantage of him and just wanted to sell him a wild horse, but he did not believe it. He kept riding this wild horse and kept getting thrown over and over. Most of the people around him in his new tribe had the best horses. They were rarely thrown. The brave was still young and he still healed quickly even though he was thrown often. The elders always said you had to get up when you were thrown or you were weak. So, he always got back up and got back on the horse.

One day, the chief said he had a special assignment for the brave. The brave felt honored. The chief gave him a special horse that he asked the brave to take on a long journey. The chief also sent an elder along on this journey with the brave. This horse was incredibly wild and the journey was long. Every time the brave was thrown off the horse, the elder would beat him and chastise him for not knowing how to ride the horse. He would tell him how special and good the horse was and he would tell him over and over how he himself was able to stay on his own horse. For a long time, the brave believed him. Then, the brave began to notice how well trained the elder's horse was. He noticed he was hardly ever thrown. He thought back and noticed this was true of all the horses rode by the elders and their offspring and even most of the tribe.

By the time they came back from the journey, the brave was completely broken. He had been thrown hundreds, maybe even thousands of times. The chief and the elders chastised him for walking funny and being in pain. They accused him of ruining the horse. One day, the brave overheard the chief and an elder talking. The chief said "I am very happy the brave broke that wild mustang for my son. I never would have put my own son on that horse". The son took the horse and abused it and one day, it broke it's leg and they had to put the horse down. The brave cried and cried because he had broken the horse and had gotten very close to it. But then son never appreciate any of it.

After all these things, the brave had an awakening. He realized the chief had intentionally gave him a wild horse while telling him the horse was good and safe. He had made him feel like he as a bad rider but really, it was because he had been such a good rider, brave and warrior that the chief had chosen him. He used him.

The brave could no longer even mount a horse, his body was so broken. He had healed from all the falls but his body would have pain until he died for all the falls he took. He left the tribe. The tribe, elders and chief criticized him for leaving saying that they had given him such a special assignment and he never appreciated it. They said he was weak and useless because he could no longer ride.

The brave knew he would never ride again but he began to understand that you did not have to ride a horse to be brave. There were other ways that his mind was opening to. Every once in a while, he would sit outside the tribe in the dark, wishing he could see people that he loved but that trusted and revered the chief. He never would. He prayed for the chief and all the people in the tribe. He felt sorry for all of them. He was healed but the pain would always remain. He went back to his original tribe but he wasn't really 100% part of them either.

He walked wherever he went. And he thanked God. Some people never get up from a horse throw.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by ILG

I appreciate what you wrote very much. It is very nice. That said, please don't assume that I have not prayed for those who hurt me. Actually, I don't hold much malice towards them. I hold some resentment but for the most part, it is let go. People also assume that because I am not attending church that I must still have gaping open wounds. I lay in bed last night and this allegory came to mind:

The Indian Brave

There once was an Indian Brave who was part of a tribe who valued horse riding very highly. He was not originally part of this tribe, but of another, whose parents gave him and untrained, wild horse. He fell off of this horse a number of times and healed and got back on only to be thrown again and again. He decided to become part of another tribe that he felt would give him a better horse. This tribe seemed very regal and strong. He was angry that he was given a wild, untrained horse when he was so young and felt he should have been started out on a better trained horse. He did ache in some spots, but he would find a better horse and be part of a better tribe. He was still young.

This tribe criticized his parents and his old tribe telling him that they never should have given him that wild horse at such a young age. He began to trust this tribe because they said all the right things. This tribe did not give him a horse but he had to earn his own. When he finally got his horse, after much fanfare by the elders about how well trained and wonderful this horse was, he found this horse to be very wild as well, but he trusted the elders and when he fell off the horse, he blamed himself. This happened over and over again. He could see the horse was wild. Others from his old tribe told him the elders were taking advantage of him and just wanted to sell him a wild horse, but he did not believe it. He kept riding this wild horse and kept getting thrown over and over. Most of the people around him in his new tribe had the best horses. They were rarely thrown. The brave was still young and he still healed quickly even though he was thrown often. The elders always said you had to get up when you were thrown or you were weak. So, he always got back up and got back on the horse.

One day, the chief said he had a special assignment for the brave. The brave felt honored. The chief gave him a special horse that he asked the brave to take on a long journey. The chief also sent an elder along on this journey with the brave. This horse was incredibly wild and the journey was long. Every time the brave was thrown off the horse, the elder would beat him and chastise him for not knowing how to ride the horse. He would tell him how special and good the horse was and he would tell him over and over how he himself was able to stay on his own horse. For a long time, the brave believed him. Then, the brave began to notice how well trained the elder's horse was. He noticed he was hardly ever thrown. He thought back and noticed this was true of all the horses rode by the elders and their offspring and even most of the tribe.

By the time they came back from the journey, the brave was completely broken. He had been thrown hundreds, maybe even thousands of times. The chief and the elders chastised him for walking funny and being in pain. They accused him of ruining the horse. One day, the brave overheard the chief and an elder talking. The chief said "I am very happy the brave broke that wild mustang for my son. I never would have put my own son on that horse". The son took the horse and abused it and one day, it broke it's leg and they had to put the horse down. The brave cried and cried because he had broken the horse and had gotten very close to it. But then son never appreciate any of it.

After all these things, the brave had an awakening. He realized the chief had intentionally gave him a wild horse while telling him the horse was good and safe. He had made him feel like he as a bad rider but really, it was because he had been such a good rider, brave and warrior that the chief had chosen him. He used him.

The brave could no longer even mount a horse, his body was so broken. He had healed from all the falls but his body would have pain until he died for all the falls he took. He left the tribe. The tribe, elders and chief criticized him for leaving saying that they had given him such a special assignment and he never appreciated it. They said he was weak and useless because he could no longer ride.

The brave knew he would never ride again but he began to understand that you did not have to ride a horse to be brave. There were other ways that his mind was opening to. Every once in a while, he would sit outside the tribe in the dark, wishing he could see people that he loved but that trusted and revered the chief. He never would. He prayed for the chief and all the people in the tribe. He felt sorry for all of them. He was healed but the pain would always remain. He went back to his original tribe but he wasn't really 100% part of them either.

He walked wherever he went. And he thanked God. Some people never get up from a horse throw.

Oh I could see clearly where your analogy was going! What a great story, and a clear picture of the abuse that people suffer at the hands of those who have "silver tongues".

I could see the picture you painted as well, as suffering again, and again at the hands of those you trusted.

But again, when we look at Christ's death on Calvary, it seemed that all hope was lost with his death. His friends, the closest one to him had betrayed him. He was a broken man, alone, naked, and wounded on that cross. Yet, because of that death, new life was able to come forth.

There is still life in you ILG! From this bitter experience, there can come greater, more beautiful things. I believe it with all my heart, because of Calvary.

While the above allegory is true, you may carry those wounds, and scars, BUT God is not finished with your life yet. You will have a story to tell indeed.

I am thinking of the parable of the Samaritan. He was left for dead, broken, bleeding, and many passed by who should have stopped and helped. But one man did stop, and made all the difference for him. He took him home, and cleaned up his wounds, lodged him until he was well.

This is what Jesus intends to do for all those broken, weary, hurting people. He did it on Calvary, and He is still doing it today.

I think this experience you have been through can make you stronger by realizing who you are in Christ, and the ministry you and your husband had can be shaped and directed by Jesus into something much better than you ever imagined.

Maybe a church building is not for you. It isn't for us either, at least not yet, because the Lord hasn't led us to one. But, we have found a body of spirit filled believers to worship with. This has helped us heal, more than any other thing we have done in our journey away from the abusive churches we had always been a part of.

I don't condemn or look down on anyone attending a building with a name over its door, God Bless them. But the Lord has led us to the home groups, and we have been blessed to be a part of this body of believers. He did it for us. He can do it for anyone

[ILG]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Oh I could see clearly where your analogy was going! What a great story, and a clear picture of the abuse that people suffer at the hands of those who have "silver tongues".

I could see the picture you painted as well, as suffering again, and again at the hands of those you trusted.

There is still life in you ILG! From this bitter experience, there can come greater, more beautiful things. I believe it with all my heart, because of Calvary.

Thanks KBTW! I'm glad you appreciate the story and took something from it.

I don't doubt there is life in me. I know there is. Some people can't see that though. All they see is that I don't ride a horse. So, I just keep on walking and knowing that it doesn't matter what they think. Most of them have been thrown a couple of times and gotten back on and are patting themselves on the back for getting back on. They think what they have been through is the same thing as what I have been through, but I don't think so. I really don't.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by ILG

Thanks KBTW! I'm glad you appreciate the story and took something from it.

I don't doubt there is life in me. I know there is. Some people can't see that though. All they see is that I don't ride a horse. So, I just keep on walking and knowing that it doesn't matter what they think. Most of them have been thrown a couple of times and gotten back on and are patting themselves on the back for getting back on. They think what they have been through is the same thing as what I have been through, but I don't think so. I really don't.

Each of us walk a different path through life, and for some there is more suffering than others. I think of young children with cancer, sexual abuse, rape, those who survived the Holocaust, torture... the list goes on and on. We can either choose to look at the glass half full or half empty. It is all in perspective. I had a dear saint tell me one time when I was really going through some things, and felt so overwhelmed. She said to find someone worse off than you, and do something for them, and it will get your mind of where you are at. It took me a while to do that, but I began to look around at other people's problems, and situations, and realized mine wasn't so bad, that I couldn't get up and keep walking. Keeping our focus on Christ first and foremost helps in every situation. It really is all about perspective, about whether you choose to focus on Christ, or focus on your problems.

I'm glad that you're still walking sister!

[AreYouReady?]

The Hiding Place is a wonderful book. I marveled at what Corrie went through and was still able to forgive her abusers.

In the meantime, I will stay away from my abusers and try to pray for them. That is hard. So instead I will confess my inability to forgive and pray for God to help me to forgive them and for my healing. I will pray for a church system that actually has a five-fold ministry in use and feels that everybody in their system has some sort of ministry of their own to develop and be of use to the Lord.

I am prepared to love and respect others, to reconsider my thoughts and feelings, but I will not step foot into any church system where I am not treated with love and respect. That will scrape the scabs off that I want to heal.

Jesus said that his disciples are known by the love we have for one another and by our fruits. If it is not manifested in the church system, then what are we doing in a place where Jesus is not there?

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

The Hiding Place is a wonderful book. I marveled at what Corrie went through and was still able to forgive her abusers.

In the meantime, I will stay away from my abusers and try to pray for them. That is hard. So instead I will confess my inability to forgive and pray for God to help me to forgive them and for my healing. I will pray for a church system that actually has a five-fold ministry in use and feels that everybody in their system has some sort of ministry of their own to develop and be of use to the Lord.

I am prepared to love and respect others, to reconsider my thoughts and feelings, but I will not step foot into any church system where I am not treated with love and respect. That will scrape the scabs off that I want to heal.

Jesus said that his disciples are known by the love we have for one another and by our fruits. If it is not manifested in the church system, then what are we doing in a place where Jesus is not there?

There is no way I could ever go back to the very church where all this abuse took place - that would be like a dog going back to his vomit. But I can live above what took place there - and is still taking place - by praying for them. It is possible. Yet, living in the same town or area as these people was rough. We did leave the area. That in itself has also helped with my healing.

Since then, my husband and I have went to different apostolic groups and non-apostolic groups... and we have found that every.single.church in EVERY denomination has corruption at every level because we are dealing with people. People who sin. People who love human worship. It is just a fact of life. It can't be helped.

My family and I, through this long journey, have realized that we do need the body of Christ though. We cannot be the eye or the ear or the nose or the arm alone. We must be a part of a living Christ-centered body.

For our family, we have found it, not in the typical church building wtih a name over the door, but in being a part of a home group. We do attend a local church also, but we are not "members" ... but we go occasionally to visit and fellowship other people. We also have a home group that we attend, and we have bible studies and prayer time with our children on a regular basis. Because of these two things, the home group, and our own personal home bible studies with our family, that is truly where we have grown more fully into a relationship with Christ.

Each one must find his own place, but nevertheless, being part of the "body" of Christ, is a necessity. We need our brothers and our sisters to lift us up, encourage us, and to grow together into the fullness of Christ. Whether that body of Christ in your area is a home group, or a place where people meet that has a name over the door, all of us need to find Spirit filled, personal holiness minded (I didn't say standards...) people who want to live their lives with their focus centered on Christ. Wherever that is.

If there is not one in your area, give it to the Lord. He is able to lead and guide you exactly where you need to be.

So... one thing I have found to be true, spirit filled believers need each other, but we need a personal relationship with Christ even more. If you make that a priority in your life, the Spirit will guide you into a church, and a place where you need to be.