Tulsa Report Day 2 - Page 41

George · #1 01-28-2008, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by embonpoint

Perhaps the impact on California is due to men there having already seen from afar where the path some are following has led other districts. As they see what appears to be an all too familiar pattern emerging they are looking for alternatives. Just a possibility.

I seriously doubt that to be a possibility. The districts that have so many "liberals" (I hate the terms lib/con but use them for purpose of identity) have always been. There haven't been any over-night changes. There are many churches east of the western region labeled liberal where you will find on their platforms women wearing pants, jewelry, make-up, men with long hair/facial hair, etc. In the most liberal California churches, it is doubtful you would find women wearing pants, painted red fingernails, cut and dyed hair on the platform. For the 50+ years I have been around UPC, this has always been the case.

embonpoint · #2 01-28-2008, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George

I seriously doubt that to be a possibility. The districts that have so many "liberals" (I hate the terms lib/con but use them for purpose of identity) have always been. There haven't been any over-night changes. There are many churches east of the western region labeled liberal where you will find on their platforms women wearing pants, jewelry, make-up, men with long hair/facial hair, etc. In the most liberal California churches, it is doubtful you would find women wearing pants, painted red fingernails, cut and dyed hair on the platform. For the 50+ years I have been around UPC, this has always been the case.

My point is not how quickly changes have occured but that they have happened. I have seen and experienced it.

My point is that the path to those changes however quickly they have happened is not a mystery but is a familiar route.

RevBuddy · #3 01-28-2008, 04:27 PM

...and many other things.

I guess this is what worries me most...and many other things. How many "other things" are there? I said that I preach the principles of His Word...He has place sufficient principles to preach and teach about the dangers of drug abuse and pornography...but do I just carry that on and preach my dress codes as gospel, or do I couch my personal convictions in those terms - my convictions, not God's.

Felicity · #4 01-28-2008, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevBuddy

...and many other things.

I guess this is what worries me most...and many other things. How many "other things" are there? I said that I preach the principles of His Word...He has place sufficient principles to preach and teach about the dangers of drug abuse and pornography...but do I just carry that on and preach my dress codes as gospel, or do I couch my personal convictions in those terms - my convictions, not God's.

Rev. Buddy.....

If you don't mind my asking because it's related to a question your post brought to my mind ....... are you licensed with UPC?

RevBuddy · #5 01-28-2008, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Felicity

Rev. Buddy.....

If you don't mind my asking because it's related to a question your post brought to my mind ....... are you licensed with UPC?

Should I be?

Felicity · #6 01-28-2008, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevBuddy

Should I be?

Why are you asking me? LOL. Should you? I don't know. That's your choice. But my question was, "are you"?

CC1 · #7 01-28-2008, 04:33 PM

Steadfast,

If I were a cynical man I would think you are positioning yourself to preach meetings for the Tulsaites!!!

I could be wrong but I seem to remember you giving much less weight to this meeting before 1,000 of your conservative brethern showed up for it. I could be wrong. According to my wife I have been wrong before. A lot.

rgcraig · #8 01-28-2008, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CC1

Steadfast,

If I were a cynical man I would think you are positioning yourself to preach meetings for the Tulsaites!!!

I could be wrong but I seem to remember you giving much less weight to this meeting before 1,000 of your conservative brethern showed up for it. I could be wrong. According to my wife I have been wrong before. A lot.

I'm sure this is on the minds of many of them.

#9 01-28-2008, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CC1

Steadfast,

If I were a cynical man I would think you are positioning yourself to preach meetings for the Tulsaites!!!

I could be wrong but I seem to remember you giving much less weight to this meeting before 1,000 of your conservative brethern showed up for it. I could be wrong. According to my wife I have been wrong before. A lot.

CC1, 'hast thou been so long with me and yet not know me'? If I wanted to have been in Tulsa I would have been there front and center! I'm NOT looking for another place to preach as I can't keep up with my present schedule right now.

You are, thankfully, totally wrong about the 'weight' of my opinions on this matter as I've always said that the Tulsa crew had a right to do what they felt was right in their hearts. I have no beef with either side and, with God's graciousness, am in a position to be respected it seems on both sides of that coin.

I have preached for or with most all of the '6' and have a good report among those brethren. I also preach for a lot of officials as well and love those brethren equally as much. Surely the Bible is right when it tells us the value of a 'good name' being more important than 'great riches'.

For example, I'm preaching for one of the 'coordinators' and then less than a month later preaching for their District Superintendent. I'm not here with an axe to grind... just a prinicple of integrity to protect.

CC1 · #10 01-28-2008, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steadfast

CC1, 'hast thou been so long with me and yet not know me'? If I wanted to have been in Tulsa I would have been there front and center! I'm NOT looking for another place to preach as I can't keep up with my present schedule right now.

You are, thankfully, totally wrong about the 'weight' of my opinions on this matter as I've always said that the Tulsa crew had a right to do what they felt was right in their hearts. I have no beef with either side and, with God's graciousness, am in a position to be respected it seems on both sides of that coin.

I have preached for or with most all of the '6' and have a good report among those brethren. I also preach for a lot of officials as well and love those brethren equally as much. Surely the Bible is right when it tells us the value of a 'good name' being more important than 'great riches'.

For example, I'm preaching for one of the 'coordinators' and then less than a month later preaching for their District Superintendent. I'm not here with an axe to grind... just a prinicple of integrity to protect.

It should be interesting for folks like you over the next year or two. It will be interesting to see if there are no problems with you preaching for both UPC and WWPF pastors and meetings. I know theoretically there should not be but many times reality intrudes.