Tulsa Report Day 2

[stmatthew]

are we having fun yet????

[stmatthew]

At this point, some of us need to learn the wisdom of Gamaliel.

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

At this point, some of us need to learn the wisdom of Gamaliel.

Matthew, I think that is a little unfair.

May we speak about this issue, and the integrity issues involved, or not?

It would be very sad if only one side of this ongoing story was told here.

[stmatthew]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Matthew, I think that is a little unfair.

May we speak about this issue, and the integrity issues involved, or not?

It would be very sad if only one side of this ongoing story was told here.

I have no problem with speaking about the issues, and most are doing a fine job doing so (yourself included). I just have some concerns with some that have stated "the whole bunch are a cow pen full of rebels", and have likened them to "Korah". IMHO, it seems some are judging these men to hell over their departure. While I have been adamant about the ethics of the tv issue here in TN, I do not think I ever placed them in hell over their decision.

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

I have no problem with speaking about the issues, and most are doing a fine job doing so (yourself included). I just have some concerns with some that have stated "the whole bunch are a cow pen full of rebels", and have likened them to "Korah". IMHO, it seems some are judging these men to hell over their departure. While I have been adamant about the ethics of the tv issue here in TN, I do not think I ever placed them in hell over their decision.

Understood.

I agree with you on the tv thing, and logic would say that the men who demand honesty regarding tv and the affirmation statement would demand it from the Tulsa group as well.

I have never condemned them to Hell, but I think there actions - and the deception involved - will leave a lasting mark on all of us for some time to come.

[stmatthew]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Understood.

I agree with you on the tv thing, and logic would say that the men who demand honesty regarding tv and the affirmation statement would demand it from the Tulsa group as well.

I have never condemned them to Hell, but I think there actions - and the deception involved - will leave a lasting mark on all of us for some time to come.

I could levy a charge of them being unethical, but I am hearing 2 differing stories from both sides. One side impinges the other, and the other side says they did it not. Who do I believe since I do not have any evidence one way or the other? Its all supposition at this point.

[OP_Carl]

Steadfast, if your gallant defense of the inscrutable hasn't left you completely worn out, I would like to say that I, too, was uncertain of what you meant in your anecdote about shacking up and drinking.

I attributed it to your penchant for omitting a word or two in your posts by accident.

And way, way back in one thread or another, (I think it was this one) somebody posted 2 piercing questions to you and Coonskinner.

One was about the ethical breaches of lack of notification of the districts and local ministers in advance of the two conferences, and the questionable ethics of using the UPC membership roster as the first wave recruitment phone list.

The second was about the continual and recent denials that an organization was, indeed, under consideration. I just find this to be such a stretch to believe that the concept of an organization didn't cross anybody's minds until the last two or three weeks. I'm not so concerned about this notion that the plot has been underway since SLC, because there have always been predictable rumors out there.

I guess what I'm saying is that I want to agree with you but I see some inconsistencies. Granting, of course, that I'm seeing these inconsistencies on the internet.

[Apprehended]

I can tell you all about rebellion. I've been there. But, I am not on my way to hell. I repented. I know the spirit of it. I'm sure that none of them will come to me to ask what they should do, but I might suggest that they should also repent. Though not sinful, this is the work of iniquity...just plain out lawlessness. There is a way to do things, certainly the way that they have elected to do it, is NOT the way.

[revrandy]

In my short life span here on God's Green and Blue Earth....I have learned this one thing...

Sometimes taking the High road means taking the Low One....

in other words....admitting I might have been wrong even when I "felt" I was right never hurt me...

[Encryptus]

Hate to attempt to hijack the thread back to Tulsa but...

Granted we have an idea of how many attended. When will there be indication of how many actually signed up??