I find this to be unfortunate because my experience is that we (as a white culture) have much that we can learn from our AA brothers and sisters and they have equally as much that they can learn from us. Besides which, if we can't fellowship with one another here, how in the world do we think we are going to make the adjustment to fellowshipping together once we get to heaven!!!
The question is: HOW do we make this happen??? That is the million dollar question. I wish I knew the answer.
The not so funny thing is that some will blast others to hell for sleeves and skirts all the while they themselves have racism in their heart. What a shame and disgrace to the name of Jesus.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.
The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
obviously as the demographics of our churches change and they become more culturally diverse the situation with leadership will follow, just makes sense, dt
What do you know? you wear shorts! Now be quite.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.
The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
AB gave the solution! As a pastor I made sure that visible leadership was diverse. It will not happen by accident, the pastor always practices what they really believe in this matter, and the church follows. If a pastor lives in an area where there is great diversity he must take steps to develop leaders representative of that diversity who are visible viable leaders not just token members. When this is done, people who come will recognize someone like them who is truly a part of the vision of the church and they will feel much more comfortable coming on board.
I have purposely recruited or elevated blacks, hispanics, and asians for key leadership positions in the church, which always resulted in a multicultural church.
well i obviously cant speak for the organization, but after being around for over 37 years, two observations, most of the upc churches dont have a lot of americans of african descent in them, and also most of the people i know who are americans of african descent go to black pentecostal churches by choice, this is my experience , especially in the south, dt
It's not just that the UPC is a "very racist organization"...where I live in southern Cal most black people go to black churches..period. I remember witnessing to a black woman once and she said she drove past our church and just didn't know if her kind was welcome. So black people have a perception already that they go to black churches and whites go to white churches. Our church is racially mixed and always has been. It was a black person that helped bring me into the UPC
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
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There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
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obviously as the demographics of our churches change and they become more culturally diverse the situation with leadership will follow, just makes sense, dt
From my experience, nothing could be farther from the truth! If the leadership (pastor first) of the church does not have a genuine desire to reach and assimilate different cultures into the congregation, a change in demographics will have little to no effect on the local church. I have seen all white churches who's neighborhood changed around them into an all black neighborhood, and the church just became more and more uncomfortable until they relocated outside that neighborhood to another predominately white area. This is in fact a phenomenon that is being addressed in many conference now, because there are thousands of churches who have abandoned their neighborhoods and left them without spiritual impact in order to move where they are more comfortable.
It's not just that the UPC is a "very racist organization"...where I live in southern Cal most black people go to black churches..period. I remember witnessing to a black woman once and she said she drove past our church and just didn't know if her kind was welcome. So black people have a perception already that they go to black churches and whites go to white churches. Our church is racially mixed and always has been. It was a black person that helped bring me into the UPC
I visited a multicultural church near Chicago a couple months ago, and the pastor spoke on racism in the church. He said it's funny......he's heard people comment on his black church....because they passed by and saw black people exiting.
He's also heard people comment on his white church.....they were passing by and saw white people exiting......
He spoke very candidly about the stereotypes that exist between both worlds. He told the whites that a group of black men standing on a street corner didn't mean they were drug dealers. He told the blacks that they didn't have to wake up in the morning, feeling that it was another day of fighting the white folks that had it in for them.
He spoke about the Civil War and how hundreds of thousands of white men lost their lives for their freedom.
He also spoke about the statistics involving slavery and that about 3,000 black businessmen owned black slaves in the south.
He is a white pastor, and while I wasn't sure how his words would be received, he got amens from both black and white folks.
__________________
I've gone and done it now! I'm on Facebook!!!
From my experience, nothing could be farther from the truth! If the leadership (pastor first) of the church does not have a genuine desire to reach and assimilate different cultures into the congregation, a change in demographics will have little to no effect on the local church. I have seen all white churches who's neighborhood changed around them into an all black neighborhood, and the church just became more and more uncomfortable until they relocated outside that neighborhood to another predominately white area. This is in fact a phenomenon that is being addressed in many conference now, because there are thousands of churches who have abandoned their neighborhoods and left them without spiritual impact in order to move where they are more comfortable.
So very true and it happens every day! I have a friend that sold their church to a black church and moved and now the area they moved in has integrated and his church is having a lot of blacks and the whites are moving further out to a white church miles away. It is sad that people that call themselves CHRISTIANS and APOSTOLIC live like this - pure racism!
From my experience, nothing could be farther from the truth! If the leadership (pastor first) of the church does not have a genuine desire to reach and assimilate different cultures into the congregation, a change in demographics will have little to no effect on the local church. I have seen all white churches who's neighborhood changed around them into an all black neighborhood, and the church just became more and more uncomfortable until they relocated outside that neighborhood to another predominately white area. This is in fact a phenomenon that is being addressed in many conference now, because there are thousands of churches who have abandoned their neighborhoods and left them without spiritual impact in order to move where they are more comfortable.
well we will see, i sure hope the times reflect the changes in culture and makeup of our church, by the way, i didnt say this was a truth just my opinion of what i would hope happens, dt
__________________
A product of a pentecostal raisin, I am a hard man, just ask my children
So very true and it happens every day! I have a friend that sold their church to a black church and moved and now the area they moved in has integrated and his church is having a lot of blacks and the whites are moving further out to a white church miles away. It is sad that people that call themselves CHRISTIANS and APOSTOLIC live like this - pure racism!
And all the while claim to be baptized into Christ. Some believe the oneness doctrine but live a trinity!
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.
The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
AB gave the solution! As a pastor I made sure that visible leadership was diverse. It will not happen by accident, the pastor always practices what they really believe in this matter, and the church follows. If a pastor lives in an area where there is great diversity he must take steps to develop leaders representative of that diversity who are visible viable leaders not just token members. When this is done, people who come will recognize someone like them who is truly a part of the vision of the church and they will feel much more comfortable coming on board.
I have purposely recruited or elevated blacks, hispanics, and asians for key leadership positions in the church, which always resulted in a multicultural church.
Bishop, I completely agree with you. Unfortunately, my experience doesn't work out quite the same. I am on the Board for Emmaus. We got some complaints not long ago because we don't have anyone "of color" (their words, not mine) on the board. I asked what they would like us to do and was told that we should make sure that next time we have elections, we have several people of color running for the positions. So now it's time for elections. We have 5 positions open. 4000 members in this organization. And we've made more phone calls than I care to count. Not one person of color was willing to say "yes" to running for the Board.
If they had agreed to run, it is a given that they would have gotten on the Board. We have 5 positions open and only 5 people running for those positions. It seems NO ONE wants to be in leadership
__________________
Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of a battle ! ! ! !
Happens every day!
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