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WPF News Discussion of the WWPF meetings in Tulsa and related sidetracks.


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  #401  
Old 03-16-2008, 04:33 PM
Brother Price Brother Price is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Quote:
Originally Posted by angelwannabe View Post
Sounds like while he's congratulating himself for making a change from a self confessed mistake, that he is in turn condemning many other men of God at the same time.
AWB, you almost made me post in the way my flesh would have liked. I was about to call out the spirit of religion. But, ya know what? I do not know you. I do not know your past, your history, your testimony. I have no place to judge you. I have no right to judge you. And, I will no longer judge you.

Let there be no strife between us. If you want to continue, so be it. I will not. I will not allow that spirit to try to bring me back to that religiously hateful, arrogant, judgmental man that Christ has delivered me from.

You say what you want. I just wanna stay in the shadow of the Cross.

Baruch Ha'Shem!
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  #402  
Old 03-16-2008, 04:38 PM
angelwannabe angelwannabe is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: down south
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Please everyone, I ask for your forgiveness. I have seen the error of my ways, thinking and words. I will do my best not to do this again. Please forgive me.
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  #403  
Old 03-16-2008, 05:04 PM
AmazingGrace AmazingGrace is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

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Originally Posted by angelwannabe View Post
I don't remember replying to you, nor do I know You. I've disagreed with one person here and commented to one preacher who made some disturbing confessions. Now you are telling me how I'm supposed to be...Will anyone here defend me from your unFRIENDLY comments. Calling me a stinky skunk is your way of wanting to make friends? I'm sorry, I didn't know speaking your mind was against the rules to "newbies." A long time lurker? I've been on this for about two weeks and have just been allowed to post. I see a lot of disagreeing and back talking by many posters. Why don't everyone play by the same rules.
It does not matter if you replied to me or not... you replied to my friends and family... One thing about this forum... we have all pretty much been together for a long time and dont take to someone coming in and acting like you have... No I dont think anyone here will defend you! You will probably find a lot more who feel the same way I do if you continue with your current posting style. And nope this is not my way of attempting to make friends.. have no desire to make friends with someone who comes in like you have with the slams you have against those we all care about here... As for just being allowed to post.. I am so glad they have that included there... might be a good thing... And yes you will see a lot of disagreeing and fussing... but the one thing you will see is when one of the dysfunctional aff family LOL is in need... we are all together 150% and no one can break it... when someone needs someone to pray... no one can stop it and when we all need a friend... We can find tons... I would ask you to please consider what you have done and what I have suggested you change... It might help in your future here on the forum if you plan to have one... and have a fun time... we will welcome those gladly who come with a right spirit... its those with a nasty attitude that get us to all turn somewhat protective...
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  #404  
Old 03-16-2008, 05:05 PM
AmazingGrace AmazingGrace is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

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Originally Posted by angelwannabe View Post
Please everyone, I ask for your forgiveness. I have seen the error of my ways, thinking and words. I will do my best not to do this again. Please forgive me.
Well glad to see a change.. I pray its to stay... And BTW... Welcome to AFF...
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  #405  
Old 03-17-2008, 04:00 PM
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Ferd Ferd is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Yes. you should keep the old way of Holiness.
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  #406  
Old 03-17-2008, 04:23 PM
Jehoram Jehoram is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Throw em all out.
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  #407  
Old 03-17-2008, 10:14 PM
CAD/JPY CAD/JPY is offline
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Posts: 142
Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

I am a true lurker of this forum. This is my first post, but I was challenged by the solid thinking of some posters that I felt I must contribute… for better or for worse.

When Uzziah entered into the temple to offer sacrifice was he trying to be less “spiritual” or more “spiritual”? The Bible tells us that when he was strong, his heart was lifted up to his destruction. The problem with “spiritual” pride is it tends to make people more religious… which was exactly the problem with Uzziah when he decided that he was “spiritual” enough to be able to offer incense where only priests were allowed.

How does all that tie into a discussion on standards? Many people as they become more “spiritual” with pride will allow themselves liberty in interpreting scripture to fit their religious standard. Somehow Uzziah thought he was correct in his deeds, the Bible actually says he became angry with the priests when they confronted him. Just like today, many people become angry if questioned why this belief, why this standard, and then if you confront someone to prove it scripturally….. that makes it even worse!
We should often remind ourselves of the example of Uzziah.

IF it is truth, then we should not be scared to discuss it or QUESTION it. Truth will stand on its own.

The majority of Pentecostal holiness standards are simply the choice of what conservative men and women of North America would have chosen to live by at the time our UPCI manual was written. These conservative men and women were Atheist, Mormon, Baptist, Trinitarian, etc. and the majority dressed a certain way.

I believe in principled standards. The principle being the concern, the standard we choose to express that principle will vary depending on the culture we are in and the situation.
Example: Dressing modestly for a man and a woman is a scriptural teaching. However if you say that a woman must always wear a dress in order to distinguish herself from a man, and then apply that rigidly across the world, you will face situations where it is impossible for a woman to wear a dress and be modest. So what to do? I choose the principle first, because that is Biblical, the standard becomes my interpretation for the culture and situation I live in.

We run into problems when we try to prove our conservative “holiness” standards as ancient writings of biblical truth. People so strongly want to prove their traditional holiness standards as “truth” that they take biblical verses and stretch and twist them in an effort to support their cause. (For the sake of respect, I choose not to give specific examples.) This is no different than Uzziah becoming lifted up and believing he could make his own rules….

It is not disrespectful to ask questions and look for Biblical support of holiness standards. Nor is it wrong to suggest that certain things may need to change… especially if we are aligning ourselves more clearly to the Word of God. Scripture actually encourages us to do so. (Search the scriptures… Work out your own salvation… etc)

Now the real issue that concerns me. How many people are lost and not finding salvation because our Apostolic churches have become so focused on traditional holiness standards that we inadvertently create a stumbling block for the lost in our cities?? Our focus becomes “enforcement” instead of “evangelism”, “labeling” instead of “love”, and “standards” instead of “salvation”. What have we become........?
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  #408  
Old 03-17-2008, 10:20 PM
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Fiyahstarter Fiyahstarter is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Nice post CAD.

Welcome to the forum!
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  #409  
Old 03-17-2008, 11:20 PM
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ForeverBlessed ForeverBlessed is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Quote:
Originally Posted by CAD/JPY View Post
I am a true lurker of this forum. This is my first post, but I was challenged by the solid thinking of some posters that I felt I must contribute… for better or for worse.

When Uzziah entered into the temple to offer sacrifice was he trying to be less “spiritual” or more “spiritual”? The Bible tells us that when he was strong, his heart was lifted up to his destruction. The problem with “spiritual” pride is it tends to make people more religious… which was exactly the problem with Uzziah when he decided that he was “spiritual” enough to be able to offer incense where only priests were allowed.

How does all that tie into a discussion on standards? Many people as they become more “spiritual” with pride will allow themselves liberty in interpreting scripture to fit their religious standard. Somehow Uzziah thought he was correct in his deeds, the Bible actually says he became angry with the priests when they confronted him. Just like today, many people become angry if questioned why this belief, why this standard, and then if you confront someone to prove it scripturally….. that makes it even worse!
We should often remind ourselves of the example of Uzziah.

IF it is truth, then we should not be scared to discuss it or QUESTION it. Truth will stand on its own.

The majority of Pentecostal holiness standards are simply the choice of what conservative men and women of North America would have chosen to live by at the time our UPCI manual was written. These conservative men and women were Atheist, Mormon, Baptist, Trinitarian, etc. and the majority dressed a certain way.

I believe in principled standards. The principle being the concern, the standard we choose to express that principle will vary depending on the culture we are in and the situation.
Example: Dressing modestly for a man and a woman is a scriptural teaching. However if you say that a woman must always wear a dress in order to distinguish herself from a man, and then apply that rigidly across the world, you will face situations where it is impossible for a woman to wear a dress and be modest. So what to do? I choose the principle first, because that is Biblical, the standard becomes my interpretation for the culture and situation I live in.

We run into problems when we try to prove our conservative “holiness” standards as ancient writings of biblical truth. People so strongly want to prove their traditional holiness standards as “truth” that they take biblical verses and stretch and twist them in an effort to support their cause. (For the sake of respect, I choose not to give specific examples.) This is no different than Uzziah becoming lifted up and believing he could make his own rules….

It is not disrespectful to ask questions and look for Biblical support of holiness standards. Nor is it wrong to suggest that certain things may need to change… especially if we are aligning ourselves more clearly to the Word of God. Scripture actually encourages us to do so. (Search the scriptures… Work out your own salvation… etc)

Now the real issue that concerns me. How many people are lost and not finding salvation because our Apostolic churches have become so focused on traditional holiness standards that we inadvertently create a stumbling block for the lost in our cities?? Our focus becomes “enforcement” instead of “evangelism”, “labeling” instead of “love”, and “standards” instead of “salvation”. What have we become........?
awesome post.. *thumbsup*
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  #410  
Old 03-18-2008, 07:41 AM
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OneAccord OneAccord is offline
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Re: Old way of Holiness Standard do we need to kee

Quote:
Originally Posted by CAD/JPY View Post
I am a true lurker of this forum. This is my first post, but I was challenged by the solid thinking of some posters that I felt I must contribute… for better or for worse.

When Uzziah entered into the temple to offer sacrifice was he trying to be less “spiritual” or more “spiritual”? The Bible tells us that when he was strong, his heart was lifted up to his destruction. The problem with “spiritual” pride is it tends to make people more religious… which was exactly the problem with Uzziah when he decided that he was “spiritual” enough to be able to offer incense where only priests were allowed.

How does all that tie into a discussion on standards? Many people as they become more “spiritual” with pride will allow themselves liberty in interpreting scripture to fit their religious standard. Somehow Uzziah thought he was correct in his deeds, the Bible actually says he became angry with the priests when they confronted him. Just like today, many people become angry if questioned why this belief, why this standard, and then if you confront someone to prove it scripturally….. that makes it even worse!
We should often remind ourselves of the example of Uzziah.

IF it is truth, then we should not be scared to discuss it or QUESTION it. Truth will stand on its own.

The majority of Pentecostal holiness standards are simply the choice of what conservative men and women of North America would have chosen to live by at the time our UPCI manual was written. These conservative men and women were Atheist, Mormon, Baptist, Trinitarian, etc. and the majority dressed a certain way.

I believe in principled standards. The principle being the concern, the standard we choose to express that principle will vary depending on the culture we are in and the situation.
Example: Dressing modestly for a man and a woman is a scriptural teaching. However if you say that a woman must always wear a dress in order to distinguish herself from a man, and then apply that rigidly across the world, you will face situations where it is impossible for a woman to wear a dress and be modest. So what to do? I choose the principle first, because that is Biblical, the standard becomes my interpretation for the culture and situation I live in.

We run into problems when we try to prove our conservative “holiness” standards as ancient writings of biblical truth. People so strongly want to prove their traditional holiness standards as “truth” that they take biblical verses and stretch and twist them in an effort to support their cause. (For the sake of respect, I choose not to give specific examples.) This is no different than Uzziah becoming lifted up and believing he could make his own rules….

It is not disrespectful to ask questions and look for Biblical support of holiness standards. Nor is it wrong to suggest that certain things may need to change… especially if we are aligning ourselves more clearly to the Word of God. Scripture actually encourages us to do so. (Search the scriptures… Work out your own salvation… etc)

Now the real issue that concerns me. How many people are lost and not finding salvation because our Apostolic churches have become so focused on traditional holiness standards that we inadvertently create a stumbling block for the lost in our cities?? Our focus becomes “enforcement” instead of “evangelism”, “labeling” instead of “love”, and “standards” instead of “salvation”. What have we become........?

Very good post, Cad. Very balanced. And welcome!
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