Membership letters??!

[Fiyahstarter]

I've spent years worrying about being "accepted" by my brethren and hoping to be included. Hurtful situations for sure (standards-related).

And now this membership agreement thing is one more way that will make people feel like they don't belong, which I am sure is NOT the intent...But it will be the result.

And I'm confused. What voting are you talking about??? In ten years, we've never had a vote of any kind. We did have a business meeting once where ALL were encouraged to attend, but only "members" could speak. But no votes that I know of. Just curious.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by Fiyahstarter

I've spent years worrying about being "accepted" by my brethren and hoping to be included. Hurtful situations for sure (standards-related).

And now this membership agreement thing is one more way that will make people feel like they don't belong, which I am sure is NOT the intent...But it will be the result.

And I'm confused. What voting are you talking about??? In ten years, we've never had a vote of any kind. We did have a business meeting once where ALL were encouraged to attend, but only "members" could speak. But no votes that I know of. Just curious.

Most often the votes are for a new pastor. I am sure there are other scenarios as well but they appear to be finding plenty of places to hide in the vast emptiness that is my mind.

[Sam]

Years ago when I was going to an ALJC church we had a business meeting in early February of each year. Dinner was served and a report was given of the finances (nothing in detail). Those who were tithe payers and currently paid up were allowed to vote.

One year at the annual meeting the pastor's son was voted in as an assistant pastor. Some of the older, founding members were not present and there was some disagreement. A group left and formed another church which became UPC.

Another problem which came from that meeting was when some of the members asked for more details concerning the finances. They wanted to know salary figures. The information was refused to them. When one person pressed a little he was disfellowshipped and he took the church to court. From what I understand the judge found in his favor and I guess he got to see the figures. He and the others left and joined the church that split group.

I had already left that church several years before that meeting and split.

[stmatthew]

A lot of these "Membership Letters" and "Ministry Agreements" stem from the fear that someone will sue the church. An example would be if someone was ministering in the choir, and had stated that they agreed with standards of the church concerning jewelry, and then showed up all decked out like Mr T. If such a one was "set down", they could not run and try to sue over it because they had signed the papaer that they understood and agreed with the church standards.


Personally, I think these things are foolish, and childish. If you don't know someone by the spirit enough to trust them on the platform, then you really shouldn't bring them up there in the first place.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

Most often the votes are for a new pastor. I am sure there are other scenarios as well but they appear to be finding plenty of places to hide in the vast emptiness that is my mind.

Originally Posted by stmatthew

A lot of these "Membership Letters" and "Ministry Agreements" stem from the fear that someone will sue the church. An example would be if someone was ministering in the choir, and had stated that they agreed with standards of the church concerning jewelry, and then showed up all decked out like Mr T. If such a one was "set down", they could not run and try to sue over it because they had signed the papaer that they understood and agreed with the church standards.


Personally, I think these things are foolish, and childish. If you don't know someone by the spirit enough to trust them on the platform, then you really shouldn't bring them up there in the first place.

St, Matthew, I agree in part, depends on the situation. Some are about control and manipulation and then it is best to part ways.

Blessings, Rhoni

[stmatthew]

As far as a person not paying tithes and offerings into the local church they attend, IMHO they would be what God spoke about when he stated that some were robbers and thieves. If the local church is good enough to feed your sorry carcass, then it is good enough to receive of your financial blessings so that it can continue to feed your sorry carcass. To withhold finances from where you dine spiritually is thievery, plain and simple.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

As far as a person not paying tithes and offerings into the local church they attend, IMHO they would be what God spoke about when he stated that some were robbers and thieves. If the local church is good enough to feed your sorry carcass, then it is good enough to receive of your financial blessings so that it can continue to feed your sorry carcass. To withhold finances from where you dine spiritually is thievery, plain and simple.

The sorry carcass comment gives a lot of insight...

But... what is being discussed here is a person whose right to vote has been removed because they did not sign a membership letter.

That is what this thread is about.

[stmatthew]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

The sorry carcass comment gives a lot of insight...

But... what is being discussed here is a person whose right to vote has been removed because they did not sign a membership letter.

That is what this thread is about.

Just trying to make it more colorful.


This thread moved beyond that when several began speaking about how they would attend a church but not give to said church because they didn't like the org the church was part of. My post addressed that mentality.



As to voting membership, if you are not willing to sign a membership agreement, why should you expect to be able to vote in the club you refuse to join? That's like me saying I want to vote for the next president of the local Lions Club, but I don't want to join the Lions Club and be a member in good standing.

[tbpew]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Just trying to make it more colorful.


This thread moved beyond that when several began speaking about how they would attend a church but not give to said church because they didn't like the org the church was part of. My post addressed that mentality.



As to voting membership, if you are not willing to sign a membership agreement, why should you expect to be able to vote in the club you refuse to join? That's like me saying I want to vote for the next president of the local Lions Club, but I don't want to join the Lions Club and be a member in good standing.

I am very encouraged by this post.
Maybe, just maybe, this is a glimmer of hope that word 'church' we use so often is beginning to be replaced with the more appropriate term 'club'.

Clubs are not inherently bad, but a distributed 'club of clubs' is not God's deployment approach to his building of a house --without man's hands!

Clubs (should) serve the purposes of those who are its members. Members of the club have a reasonable expectation to support the club operations from which they benefit.

The shared experience is maintained by a fidelity statement to the founder's expectations (establishing premise) for club. I have no problem here either....just so long as we all plainly acknowledge what we have here is ----A CLUB.

Clubs have a function and service within the Kingdom(s) of men.

God's church is not a club. God's church, his habitation, is a body.

[Fiyahstarter]

Originally Posted by tbpew

I am very encouraged by this post.
Maybe, just maybe, this is a glimmer of hope that word 'church' we use so often is beginning to be replaced with the more appropriate term 'club'.

Clubs are not inherently bad, but a distributed 'club of clubs' is not God's deployment approach to his building of a house --without man's hands!

Clubs (should) serve the purposes of those who are its members. Members of the club have a reasonable expectation to support the club operations from which they benefit.

The shared experience is maintained by a fidelity statement to the founder's expectations (establishing premise) for club. I have no problem here either....just so long as we all plainly acknowledge what we have here is ----A CLUB.

Clubs have a function and service within the Kingdom(s) of men.

God's church is not a club. God's church, his habitation, is a body.

Well put.