Apostolic girls and sports

[ronharvey]

I raised 3 girls to knock the teeth out of any one who tried to harm them.

I never allowed them to play in sports because of the type of clothing used in a mixed company of onlookers (this excludes PE which girls and boys were separated).

I always felt there was no difference in location if it is wrong it is wrong.

I have not found a president for some forms of clothing being wrong if they are modest and non revealing.

I remember culots (sp) being preached against as being sinful when the man preaching the message; his own daughter wore them and he never knew it because she wore a 'pleat' in the front and back.

I stay away from the clothesline and allow God to do the convicting.

When I was 21 I was teaching a group of kids at the Harlow's Children's Ranch in Nocona, Texas and I read the passage

Deuteronomy 22:5 "The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God."

Which verse falls within verses that refer to being kind to animals. This verse has no context to draw from in this case.

All at once the girls raised their hands and asked, it that's so, why does your aunt wear pants?

Nothing was even in the conversation about pants or clothing. It was listing several verses that were out of an actual context, yet these teenage, non Christian girls, knew that men's clothing was different than women's.

I leave it to personal conviction.

Ron

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by ronharvey

I leave it to personal conviction.

Ron

Really, that is what threads like these boil down to. Ultimately, families have to determine what is best for their children based on their belief/value system.

My only concern would be that in families where the husband and wife disagree, they make sure they reach an agreement. My husband and I have a "no-vote-wins" rule. That is, if one of us feels terribly uncomfortable with something, or thinks its unsafe or inappropriate, the no-vote wins, because I wouldn't want to have my children involved in something that violates my husband's convictions, beliefs, or that he feels will place them in harm's way, and vice versa.

That said, when we disagree, we do try to persuade the other one to come around...lol...but out of the kids' earshot, AND we don't wield the "no-vote" as a weapon.

It's more important for parents to be seen as a team by their kids than for their kids to play on a team and disrespect the wishes of one of their parents.

I don't think this should turn into a pants vs. no-pants argument. Renee and her husband need to come to an agreement based on their beliefs, and make a decision regarding their children accordingly. We can all give our opinions, but decisions like these are personal.

One thing that hasn't been brought up (I don't think) is what the church teaches. I think it's important to keep your family's activities in line with church teachings, both for the sake of submitting to authority, and also for the sake of not alienating your children from other families in the assembly. If the church you attend has rules you can't reasonably comply with, you should either let your pastor know your conflicts, and be up front about it, OR attend a church whose views more closely match your own.

I'm always of the opinion that certain lessons are more important than others, and submission to authority AND respecting authority are good lessons for children to learn--from their parents' example.

[Jake in TX]

Whatever happened to women not wearing mens' apparel?

[scotty]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

My daughters have both played basketball, and Sarah is playing again this year. We let them wear the team uniform, because the shorts are knee length and loose, and they wear plain white t-shirts under the top. We did request a couple sizes up in the shorts so they would be long and loose (they cinch up at the waist with a drawstring). So they don't look much different than culottes.

Our reasoning is: they need the physical activity, team sports teach a lot of good lessons, and they can learn to be modest in whatever they do. I do insist on modest uniforms, single-gender activities (if the uniforms aren't modest, such as in gymnastics), and if that isn't possible, another activity can be chosen.

However. If you teach your children that it is a sin to wear pants or shorts at all (if you're a girl), then it would be inconsistent to allow it for sports, in my opinion. We approach it differently in our house, with modesty being the overall theme, and gender distinction playing a secondary but still important role. I don't believe particular items of clothing are sinful across the board, nor are various stages of dress or undress. What is appropriate or not depends on the circumstance. If you approach it from the opposite end of the spectrum, ruling out specific items of clothing, then you can't then approach it from the other perspective without confusing your children.

Good stuff.

My daughter plays basketball and volleyball. Same stipulations as yours. The shorts now days are practicly coulottes(sp). and shirts are worn underneath the tops. I coach both the girls and the boys basketball.

[scotty]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Really, that is what threads like these boil down to. Ultimately, families have to determine what is best for their children based on their belief/value system.

My only concern would be that in families where the husband and wife disagree, they make sure they reach an agreement. My husband and I have a "no-vote-wins" rule. That is, if one of us feels terribly uncomfortable with something, or thinks its unsafe or inappropriate, the no-vote wins, because I wouldn't want to have my children involved in something that violates my husband's convictions, beliefs, or that he feels will place them in harm's way, and vice versa.

That said, when we disagree, we do try to persuade the other one to come around...lol...but out of the kids' earshot, AND we don't wield the "no-vote" as a weapon.

It's more important for parents to be seen as a team by their kids than for their kids to play on a team and disrespect the wishes of one of their parents.

I don't think this should turn into a pants vs. no-pants argument. Renee and her husband need to come to an agreement based on their beliefs, and make a decision regarding their children accordingly. We can all give our opinions, but decisions like these are personal.

One thing that hasn't been brought up (I don't think) is what the church teaches. I think it's important to keep your family's activities in line with church teachings, both for the sake of submitting to authority, and also for the sake of not alienating your children from other families in the assembly. If the church you attend has rules you can't reasonably comply with, you should either let your pastor know your conflicts, and be up front about it, OR attend a church whose views more closely match your own.

I'm always of the opinion that certain lessons are more important than others, and submission to authority AND respecting authority are good lessons for children to learn--from their parents' example.

Ummmmm, do you have any single sisters ??

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by scotty

Ummmmm, do you have any single sisters ??

No! I have 3 older sisters, but they're all married. Sorrrrryyyyyyy!

[GraceAmazing]

I agree with MissBrattified about making sure you stay with consistent teachings. If you teach your daughter that wearing shorts/pants are wrong, then sports are out of the question.

I'm speaking from experience. I have a daughter that will soon be 8 years old. She is an EXCELLENT soccer and basketball player. She can outkick any boy in her soccer league and she has already been cleared to play 5th grade basketball and she's only in
2nd grade!!!! We allowed her to wear soccer shorts even though we went to a UP Church that taught against women wearing pants. Needless to say, it confused her...BIG TIME! She didn't understand why she could wear them on Saturdays to the games and to practice on Thursday night, but every other day of the week it was wrong.

Make sure you are consistent...if not you'll build enough confusion in them to make them question for the rest of their life possibly.

IMHO...

[pelathais]

Yes. My daughter gets to do do pretty much whatever she wants because she's "daddy's girl!"

That, and I trust her to make the right decisions. She's the goalie on the sophmore girls soccer team in High School. Long uncut/never been cut hair and a modest uniform. And she's getting pretty good at it.

Her old man was quite a goalie himself, back in the day. Held Canadian teams scoreless throughout a tournament once. You get to brag if you've ever done that.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Yes. My daughter gets to do do pretty much whatever she wants because she's "daddy's girl!"

That, and I trust her to make the right decisions. She's the goalie on the sophmore girls soccer team in High School. Long uncut/never been cut hair and a modest uniform. And she's getting pretty good at it.

Her old man was quite a goalie himself, back in the day. Held Canadian teams scoreless throughout a tournament once. You get to brag if you've ever done that.

LOL! I was more interested in the Liverpool vs Chelsea Football (soccer) game in England than the Super Bowl here in the USA.

Congrats on keeping a clean sheet!!

[scotty]

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