Is this the scripture we teach to be separate?

[Ron]

One person brought up in a thread some time ago in a Galaxy far, far, away, about there not being anymore "newfound convictions" just "newfound liberties."

Interesting statement!

[A.W. Bowman]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

The life of a Christian will separate us from the world naturally--it doesn't have to be a deliberate separation just for the sake of it. We shouldn't choose to do something opposite of an unbeliever simply to separate ourselves from them. Everything we do should be as unto the Lord, and we will naturally be set apart or different from unbelievers, even those who also dress modestly. (Because their character will be different from ours.)

Separation unto God is a better way to look at it, because too often people think of separation from the world as "doing the opposite of what worldly people do." It's not quite the same thing.

Separation also doesn't mean that we eliminate contact, another fallacy that has greatly injured the church and outreach.

A most excellent post!

[A.W. Bowman]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I heard Nona Freeman preach at a ladies meeting years ago. She gave us this advice - "If you think your pastor is wrong, pray that God will change him or move him OR change you or move you." Good advice.

I don't direct the following to you - just expressing myself further - I have no patience, anymore, on these types of subjects. It is no one's place to tell me where I need to be in my life. My life belongs to God alone. If He tells me, for the rest of my life, to stay in the UPC, that is what I will be doing. I am adamant. He has always told me when I am moving and where I am going. It has never happened for me any other way.

I feel as though somehow, we have gotten the idea that we get to make the decisions for God. I don't know where I will be in 10 years. I don't know what changes will be taking place. I've seen a whole lot of change in the last 10 years - big changes. Because I want to stay inside the place He has set out for me - to mold me, direct me, and prepare me to be received by Him some day - some of these issues are not up for evaluation.

That is just the kind of thinking that gets folks in trouble with some in church leadership - going directly to your father, rather than going through a priest and getting his approval first.

[Scott Hutchinson]

The church should be insulated by The Holy Spirit but not isolated from our society.

[A.W. Bowman]

Ps 1. gives the principles of spiritual separation from the world. As was pointed out by others: It is not a bunch of do's and don'ts, separation is a life style, a mode of being (of existing), a condition of the heart. To be seperate unto God is also to be holy (the term defined).

It is God who has made us holy unto Himself, not by our works or effort. Our job is to live as though we actually believed that our oliness is an established fact. But, as no two vessels are exactly alike, neither are the requirements as to their individual use. To take a vessel used for old wine and force it to hold new wine is begging for discord and “rebellion”, and to scapegoat the vessel for the failure of the wine master will not work. The owner of the vineyard is neither blind nor easily fooled. The wine master shall indeed be held accountable for his misuse of the owners resources and the loss of both the new and old wine.

Another way of putting it is: We are to judge things with a righteous judgment, as God judges, not as man judges. But, as long as we are in the mode of comparing ourselves to one another and establishing levels of holiness (separation from the world) according to our own standards of righteousness, we shall continue to fall short of the glory of God. [This is another subject/thread.]

Ask any parent who has a “large family”, say three or more kids. If you treat all of them in exactly the same way, requiring exactly the same standards of dress, talents/abilities, behavior, interest, language, etc. you will end up killing off your kids – or they, you. Do not expect all to want to become hockey players or violinist. To like red dresses or only blue. One boy may want to shave his head(short hair means to be shaven in some eyes), the other to let his hair cover his ears. In many of such cases we would play Solomon; and to resolve the issue of the hair length would be to either cut of the boys ears (remove the standard), or their heads (remove the source of contention). This is the approach so many have taken to these kinds of issues, i.e., we strive for uniformity over unity, and wonder what there is so much strife and discontent within the church body.

We have way too many would be masters within the church body and not enough devoted servants.

[A.W. Bowman]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

The church should be insulated by The Holy Spirit but not isolated from our society.

Hey bro - is that a "be like Christ" example we are to imitate? Yet another noval concept - I wonder if it will fly in today's churches?

But then again, you do have a nack for bringing simple clarity to discussions! LOLOL

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

He is also quoting .... Isaiah 52:11

No, can't be! That verse only applies to the Corinthians and temple idols....idolatry outside temples is ok

[A.W. Bowman]

As a follow up.

Please note the progression in Ps 1 as it takes us through three different mindsets and their accompanying actions. The essence is the establishment of a world view and a mode of personal existence that is established on a personal relationship with God, not men. In Ps 1, when one starts to put their trust in men (seeking their approval) and giving place to the ”carnal self”, then their fall is only a matter of time and degree.

Message: Test everything and everyone! Beware of the subtle teachers who would draw you away from God, and make of you their own disciples. Also be watchful for those who would teach spiritual anarchy for that will also lead to destruction. As you can see, the admonishment to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling are not casual words, or to be taken lightly. One's salvation and discipleship to Jesus Christ are serious matters. Eternity is too serious a business to be left in the hands of Mt 23 type of spiritual masters. We need to study the word for ourselves and in interactive groups. We need to identiy thoseamong us who are spiritualy mature and full of wisdom. We need to submit to one another as well as to the elders. That is, we need to become an integrated body with Jesus as the head and the Spirit as the life giving (enabling) power.

[Praxeas]

The context shows it is more than temples and idols

2Co 6:14 Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?
2Co 6:15 What accord has Christ with Belial? Or what portion does a believer share with an unbeliever?
2Co 6:16 What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said, "I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
2Co 6:17 Therefore go out from their midst, and be separate from them, says the Lord, and touch no unclean thing; then I will welcome you,
2Co 6:18 and I will be a father to you, and you shall be sons and daughters to me, says the Lord Almighty."

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

The context shows it is more than temples and idols

2Co 6:14 Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?
2Co 6:15 What accord has Christ with Belial? Or what portion does a believer share with an unbeliever?
2Co 6:16 What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said, "I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
2Co 6:17 Therefore go out from their midst, and be separate from them, says the Lord, and touch no unclean thing; then I will welcome you,
2Co 6:18 and I will be a father to you, and you shall be sons and daughters to me, says the Lord Almighty."

This passage is often used to prohibit marriage between a believer and unbeliever. The idea being, that one important purpose of a temple's altar was that vows and oaths of allegiance were sworn there. To this day, marriage vows are often solemnized at the altar of a church/temple.

The Roman Catholic Church views this passage (among others) as forbidding their adherents from joining secret organizations like the Masons due to the secret oaths that are sworn with those foul Protestants. Just about every other denomination has joined suit in one way or another, substituting "foul Protestant" with "foul Catholic" or whatever is appropriate.

HaShaliach has given us some excellent insight on the believer's responsibilities in regard to this passage. Others have remarked on the way it has been used and misused like an overly broad brush. Paul himself seems to have been aware that there might be problems with his counsel - in fact the whole purpose of 2 Corinthians was to address problems that the Corinthians had with 1 Corinthians!

The concept of separation and holiness, Paul assures us, was not the cause of these problems. The problems were with the way in which people treated one another in the name of separation and holiness:

"Ye are not straitened in us, but ye are straitened in your own bowels." 2 Corinthians 6:12

Some of the modern translations use more delicate language here and end up losing the pun hidden in the original's wordplay. Paul basically said,

"You think I'm trying to cramp you - but in reality you've just got the cramps."

Paul's cure for this situation is that the Corinthians are to become the opposite of "cramped" and be "enlarged," or more open as the apostle's own heart is opened up for them (2 Corinthians 6:11-13). It is then at this point that he offers the thoughts under consideration here.