Why Is The "Christmas Spirit" So Different?

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I do not celebrate christmas in church.

But the issue is not different from eating meats offered to idols, because the reason people were offended was because eating it was in honour of the idol in pagan circles! And offences derived due to eating the meat showed a weakness in the one offended. So the stronger "conscienced" person is told to not offend such a person. In other words, do nothing in front of a weak-conscienced person, but do it when you are not around them. Those who claim they are offended are admitting they are weak and cannot serve God if they see someone offending them. I think it is not so much offense that is the issue but rather dealing with folks who cannot stand to think someone disagrees with them.

Bingo! Huge difference between someone who finds someone elses liberties an actual stumbling block to their walk with God versus a person who simply disagrees with another persons liberties and wants to set them straight.

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I do not celebrate christmas in church.

But the issue is not different from eating meats offered to idols, because the reason people were offended was because eating it was in honour of the idol in pagan circles! And offences derived due to eating the meat showed a weakness in the one offended. So the stronger "conscienced" person is told to not offend such a person. In other words, do nothing in front of a weak-conscienced person, but do it when you are not around them. Those who claim they are offended are admitting they are weak and cannot serve God if they see someone offending them. I think it is not so much offense that is the issue but rather dealing with folks who cannot stand to think someone disagrees with them.

Why wouldn't you celebrate CHRISTmas in church?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

What is this saying:


That ye abstain from meats offered to idols

This brings up an incredibly important point.

To whom is it referring? Gentiles.

Acts 15:19-20 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: (20) But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

And what did Paul later say?

1 Corinthians 8:4-7 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one. (5) For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) (6) But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. (7) Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.

See verse 7? THAT is why Acts 15 forbade meats offered to idols because these newly saved Gentiles did not have the knowledge that meat is just meat, and they did not know that there is intrinsically nothing wrong with eating it, whether it is offered to an idol or not.

Once again, according to the context of Paul, the people offended by ANYTHING are weak in conscience and spiritually immature. The stronger in conscience and faith have to bear their infirmities and simply not do those things that offend the weak, but only when the weak are around. Otherwise we can have liberty to ourselves and do what we feel is not wrong to do while apart from the weak.

Are you saying you are weak and that someone else's liberty trips you up spiritually?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Why wouldn't you celebrate CHRISTmas in church?

The question is actually why would I?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Days of the weak is such a weak defense, we can't help the name of the days of the week, but we don't have to partake of pagan customs.

Same principle all around. So you are saying that what we cannot help, we do not have to deal with, despite identical pagan origins? THAT is inconsistent, I think.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Bingo! Huge difference between someone who finds someone elses liberties an actual stumbling block to their walk with God versus a person who simply disagrees with another persons liberties and wants to set them straight.

That is the whole point!

[missourimary]

I see Christmas in two ways:
As a Christian holiday, remembering Jesus birth and the gift He gave us, and setting aside special time to give to others and consider them.
As a cultural holiday complete with reindeer and snowmen and elves.

I celebrate the Christian holiday at church. I celebrate the cultural holiday to some degree on my own. I'm not against either, but for me it wouldn't be much of a holiday if it didn't celebrate Jesus. Refusing to celebrate the cultural part isn't difficult for me. Refusing to celebrate the Christian part is.

[sandie]

Well, celebrating Christmas sure gets the secular athiest up in arms!
To even say Merry Christmas is this side of a four letter word.

So, I like to say it all the more.

[Sabby]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

What is this saying:


That ye abstain from meats offered to idols

MB, it could be frustration due to disagreement.

The key to that scripture is "offered to idols"

What I do at Christmas time is not offered to idols, though I will confess to mailing cards, preparing a celebratory meal (in honor of the Lord Jesus) that my WHOLE family can partake of, and even wanting to bless my loved ones with gifts. My tree or stepping on a crack playing hopscotch, or twisting the stem off an apple...are not offered to idols.

I seem to recall a few years ago the doctrine of "offenses" being preached where standards and convictions such as these were preached, and those that were offended by them were considered the "weaker" brethren. One PK told me that "offenses will come" in the sense that it's inevitable that people will "fall away" due to the strong preaching of the word.

You've got a right to your opinion...and I have the right to my liberty in Christ. My liberty in Christ does not make me a "weaker" brother, btw, and neither does your conviction about Christmas make you the "stronger". It is simply your conviction. What you seem to be generalizing about is other people's MOTIVES for celebrating Christmas.

Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand. Romans 14:4

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by sandie

Well, celebrating Christmas sure gets the secular athiest up in arms!
To even say Merry Christmas is this side of a four letter word.

So, I like to say it all the more.

Amen. The enemy is trying to eradicate Jesus from Christmas, so we need to push Jesus more and more at Christmastime.