For those not for the UPCI, what org and why?

[Godzchild]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

First of all although there are other Oneness organizations the UPCI is the biggest so naturally the biggest one is the favorite target.

Every church has its own issues and problems, so there is not perfect alternative to the UPCI

Of course everyone roots for their team. but many would disagree with your statement "this is the closest we've ever known" for you probably only know the UPCI, if you visited other churches then you would get a different view. You would see that others believe their church is the closest they've ever known.

The comments against the UPC is mostly of their own fault, they have elevated some of their own cultural teachings on the par to the Scriptures, just like the Pharisees did at the time of Jesus and that is the main problem.

The majority of the people in this forum are not against the Acts 2:38 message or the oneness message, but they are against the extra man-made rules that the UPCI has added to the gospel, those are the points of contention.

[NewbieMisfits]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

First of all although there are other Oneness organizations the UPCI is the biggest so naturally the biggest one is the favorite target.

^^^ Well that makes sense, never do I think of the simple stuff


Every church has its own issues and problems, so there is not perfect alternative to the UPCI

^^^ Exactly, so why ever look elsewhere


Of course everyone roots for their team. but many would disagree with your statement "this is the closest we've ever known" for you probably only know the UPCI, if you visited other churches then you would get a different view. You would see that others believe their church is the closest they've ever known.

^^^ This is true, this is our first & last Apostolic or Pentecostal Church. If we get ran out of this Church, it will be the last one we ever attend (spent years looking for another after the Menno's and won't go thru that hardship again.


The comments against the UPC is mostly of their own fault, they have elevated some of their own cultural teachings on the par to the Scriptures, just like the Pharisees did at the time of Jesus and that is the main problem.

This is found among all conservative org.s I've ever known.


The majority of the people in this forum are not against the Acts 2:38 message or the oneness message, but they are against the extra man-made rules that the UPCI has added to the gospel, those are the points of contention.

But I would argue that our generation, and more so my boy's gen, really need sets of rules laid out and to be kept in check of. On our very first Sunday that we spoke with our pastor, he asked what brought us there and what we expect to find... my reply to both was "discipline". Some have good control from the world, but without this I get sucked up into it.

Thanks for all the input everyone

[n david]

Born and raised in the UPC. Currently involved with an Independent Apostolic church. My only contention with the UPC is this: I'm not a fan of most district boards; which is ironic, because DBs are comprised of pastors and ministers from the state or nearby area. I believe the local church should be autonomous, not regulated by a district board or national headquarters. I understand you can keep the church unaffiliated from the organization, but that does not solve everything. Having a church which is unaffiliated can still cause issues with the district board. I've seen too often a jealous DB member stir up strife against a pastor whose ministry is thriving, only to cause division and schisms.

The local church and its pastor and church board know best how to reach their city. The UPC would be better holding guidelines for licensed ministers and pastors, along with a framework of doctrinal beliefs, but allowing the pastors and local church to do what they need to do to impact their cities.

Unfortunately, sometimes the district boards are more a hindrance than a help.

Beyond that, I have many friends in the UPC; I love visiting UPC churches and worshiping with them. I love that the UPC preaches repentance, baptism in Jesus Name and the infilling of the Holy Ghost. I love that UPC churches aren't afraid of the label of "emotionalism" because of their exuberance in worship. I love that, in most UPC churches, you can still hear messages against sin; whereas most non-denom, "charismatic" (for lack of a better word) churches rarely do.

JMO

[Timmy]

AARP.

[Timmy]

Originally Posted by houston

I am not sure why I was singled out.

Not sure why I wasn't.

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by NewbieMisfits

But I would argue that our generation, and more so my boy's gen, really need sets of rules laid out and to be kept in check of. On our very first Sunday that we spoke with our pastor, he asked what brought us there and what we expect to find... my reply to both was "discipline". Some have good control from the world, but without this I get sucked up into it.

Why would a person need a preacher to set the rules laid out and be kept in check? isn't that what parents are there for, if parents needs the preacher to do that then the parents have failed in their mission in raising their children.

When I was in the Military I learned a valuable lesson, the drill sergeant can force you to be disciplined but it is only outward disciple, likewise a preacher can cajole people into discipline, however the moment the preacher is not there the discipline disappears, real discipline is internal.

The only real discipline is self-discipline. The preacher is not going to be there when they are walking by a bar, or passing thru the liquor store.

[Ferd]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

Why would a person need a preacher to set the rules laid out and be kept in check? isn't that what parents are there for, if parents needs the preacher to do that then the parents have failed in their mission in raising their children.

When I was in the Military I learned a valuable lesson, the drill sergeant can force you to be disciplined but it is only outward disciple, likewise a preacher can cajole people into discipline, however the moment the preacher is not there the discipline disappears, real discipline is internal.

The only real discipline is self-discipline. The preacher is not going to be there when they are walking by a bar, or passing thru the liquor store.

Geez

Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?


1 Cor 11:1-2
1Be ye followers of me, even as I also [am] of Christ.
2Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered [them] to you.


Eph 4:11-12
11And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

2 Tim 3:16-17
16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.


Yea I say unto thee! Paul was just a mean jerk preacher telling people what to do!

1 Cor 6:18-20
18Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
19What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.


good grief.

[Godzchild]

Originally Posted by Ferd

Geez

Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?


1 Cor 11:1-2
1Be ye followers of me, even as I also [am] of Christ.
2Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered [them] to you.


Eph 4:11-12
11And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

2 Tim 3:16-17
16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.


Yea I say unto thee! Paul was just a mean jerk preacher telling people what to do!

1 Cor 6:18-20
18Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
19What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.


good grief.

[houston]

That was uncalled for, Ferd.

[houston]

If you do not see how a church turning into a cult is a bad thing... Keep drinking the Kool Aid...