Howdy Ferd! Nope, you're color blind on this one. In this go around, I am one of the guys wearing the white hat.
Tell you what. you give me ONE scripture from the New Testement that tells us to use music in our services and I will give you ONE scripture from the New Testement that says we can own weapons.
lets start with that.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Brother Strange, why are you so unkind? I think I have more than shown myself to be willing to talk about these things. Why do you treat me so unkindly?
I'm sorry if you think me unkind. Really, I am not. I suppose my pointed response comes across that way, but I am really very sweet. Ask my adoring wife... :d
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Are you ever going to deal with my question? Are we still to kill disobedient children by stoning? Remember, this is from the same One God.
I've dealt with it. I am surprised that you still keep asking what I at first considered a moot point since you did not recognize it yourself.
Quote:
You are the one who will not discuss this in a way that makes sense. I keep asking you the same thing, and you keep jumping to another issue. Let's try this again: What about Deut. 21:18-21?
God has not changed his mind or his attitude either. God is all for Capital punishement. However, it is as it always has been, capital punishment is under the direction and discretion of Civil Government. Still is as it was then. Some are against putting to death those who have commited certain crimes, being so much a misguided pacificist that they are blinded to the capital punishment concept. We do not haul criminals before the church nowadays. We haul them up before GOVERNMENTAL magistrates who meet out punishment that fits the crime....as it has always been...even under the Mosiac Law. Civil government invovles civil LAW. The civil law was not the function of the priesthood but rather of the King. There were separation of powers even back then. Remember Hezekiah who thought that he could, as a King, also officiate in the office of the Priest. God smote him with Leoporsy. Division of God instituted powers are the same today. There is the church, being a kingdom of Priests and there is also the government under whom we are to submit ourselves.
Wow, interesting thread! Haven't read it all (later, maybe), but it doesn't seem that anybody has posted this scripture yet:
Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. 37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. 38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.
To me, it looks like Jesus is saying we ought to have some protection for ourselves. Why else would he instruct his disciples to buy a sword, if they don't have one? And they find two swords and he says that's enough, so no need to go overboard, either. Moderation! Common sense!
Just a thought.
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
Wow, interesting thread! Haven't read it all (later, maybe), but it doesn't seem that anybody has posted this scripture yet:
Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. 37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. 38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.
To me, it looks like Jesus is saying we ought to have some protection for ourselves. Why else would he instruct his disciples to buy a sword, if they don't have one? And they find two swords and he says that's enough, so no need to go overboard, either. Moderation! Common sense!
Just a thought.
Timmy, i was wanting to save that one until they could produce scripture for music in the NT.... it seemed to be the argument that if it aint in the NT, then it aint in the bible. but oh well, Timmy has provided checkmate.
we can close the thread now.
Good Job my trintarian brother.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Wow, interesting thread! Haven't read it all (later, maybe), but it doesn't seem that anybody has posted this scripture yet:
Luke 22:35 And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. 37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. 38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.
To me, it looks like Jesus is saying we ought to have some protection for ourselves. Why else would he instruct his disciples to buy a sword, if they don't have one? And they find two swords and he says that's enough, so no need to go overboard, either. Moderation! Common sense!
Just a thought.
good post!
__________________
Happy moments, PRAISE GOD.
Difficult moments, SEEK GOD.
Quiet moments, WORSHIP GOD.
Painful moments, TRUST GOD.
Every moment, THANK GOD.
Timmy, i was wanting to save that one until they could produce scripture for music in the NT.... it seemed to be the argument that if it aint in the NT, then it aint in the bible. but oh well, Timmy has provided checkmate.
we can close the thread now.
Good Job my trintarian brother.
Sorry, I jumped the .... (sorry) ... gun!
__________________
Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
God has not changed his mind or his attitude either. God is all for Capital punishement. However, it is as it always has been, capital punishment is under the direction and discretion of Civil Government. Still is as it was then. Some are against putting to death those who have commited certain crimes, being so much a misguided pacificist that they are blinded to the capital punishment concept. We do not haul criminals before the church nowadays. We haul them up before GOVERNMENTAL magistrates who meet out punishment that fits the crime....as it has always been...even under the Mosiac Law. Civil government invovles civil LAW. The civil law was not the function of the priesthood but rather of the King. There were separation of powers even back then. Remember Hezekiah who thought that he could, as a King, also officiate in the office of the Priest. God smote him with Leoporsy. Division of God instituted powers are the same today. There is the church, being a kingdom of Priests and there is also the government under whom we are to submit ourselves.
Nothing has changed in this regard.
Elder, Deut. 21 is saying parents are to turn in their disobedient children for capitol punishment. THAT is what it says. So do you believe that the government should still do this and that believing parents should obey and follow this command?
Remember, I am NOT for such punishment because I believe that Jesus gave us a better system in the New Covenant. Remember, He showed us that the end of the command is LOVE.
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The Bible is open to those that want Truth, and if they want Truth, they find Truth. They watch individuals squabble over Bible symbolism on the Internet, and leave the Message boards to enter into the real world where live people dwell, and they find Truth. The World Wide Web is full of Internet Ayatollahs who speak their mind. There is only one Truth, and it is not hidden. No matter what anyone says, Truth still converts the sincere. -DD Benincasa, 12/06/03
I'm still waiting for a scripture where Jesus commanded his church to shoot or not to shoot a wild beast or a deer for food.
Some points are just PLAIN MOOT. Some points are so ludicrous as to be almost laughable.
some things just come naturally elder, we dont have to have a biblical commmandment for all behavior do we, lol, i sure dont, some things i just gotta do, like deer hunt, lol, dt
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A product of a pentecostal raisin, I am a hard man, just ask my children
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