How many times did you ask God for the Holy Ghost?

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Strawman. I never said receiving the Holy Ghost is a command. I said that obedience to the Gospel causes God to give us the Holy Ghost. We REPENT, GET BAPTIZED and GOD GIVES the Spirit.



Yes!

Luk 11:13 KJV If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

Or it means the person is stubborn and refuses to repent over sin they are not willing to repent over, and thinks God does not see that. That is what happened to me.



I agree. It is not something we must do. How can we give ourselves the Holy Ghost?



Agreed. But it could be, but not in every case.



I disagree with that overview, since the Holy Ghost was already poured out into the world. We just need to obey in order to get it. God is always ready to give it if we simply ask and obey.



In some cases, I agree, but not all.

Yes, there are some people who really do have sin in their lives and don't get the Holy Ghost because of that. I'm all for self examination at anytime! However, just because one doesn't receive the Holy Ghost doesn't mean that they must find something wrong when they self examine themselves. Self examination should be objective. Pentecostalism doesn't teach it as such. Pentecostalism says that if you don't receive the Holy Ghost then there is something wrong with you. Instead it should be: examine yourself to see if there MIGHT BE something holding you back from the Holy Ghost.

The statement of yours I bolded is the most important. For those special cases of people that don't do anything wrong but die without the Holy Ghost, (you already conceded that they exist by saying you agree in some cases), then how will God fulfill his promise of giving the Holy Spirit to them?

EDIT: One other question for you blume: You provided a scripture that mentioned asking for the Holy Ghost and I even said I have no problem with someone asking a few times, but where is the scripture for someone begging God for the Holy Ghost?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by jfrog

Yes, there are some people who really do have sin in their lives and don't get the Holy Ghost because of that. I'm all for self examination at anytime!

And that is all I have been saying, really.

However, just because one doesn't receive the Holy Ghost doesn't mean that they must find something wrong when they self examine themselves.

Right!

Self examination should be objective. Pentecostalism doesn't teach it as such.

I know where you are coming from.

Pentecostalism says that if you don't receive the Holy Ghost then there is something wrong with you. Instead it should be: examine yourself to see if there might be something holding you back from the Holy Ghost.

I could not agree more.

The statement of yours I bolded is the most important. For those special cases of people that don't do anything wrong, (you already conceded that they exist by saying you agree in some cases), then how will God fulfill his promise of giving the Holy Spirit to them?

It could be a simple introversion, too. But I always encourage people to keep seeking and believing and not think there is something wrong if they sincerely examine themselves and see nothing wrong. I encourage GOD WILL GIVE HIS SPIRIT! And I do not say nor believe they are lost, though.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by mfblume

And that is all I have been saying, really.



Right!



I know where you are coming from.


I could not agree more.



It could be a simple introversion, too. But I always encourage people to keep seeking and believing and not think there is something wrong if they sincerely examine themselves and see nothing wrong. I encourage GOD WILL GIVE HIS SPIRIT! And I do not say nor believe they are lost, though.

EDIT: It's amazing to me how the way people word things and how placing emphasis in different spots can cause such major disagreements... but I'm glad we figured it out and reached a consensus. It's nice to end up agreeing in the end

[jfrog]

Oh, one other thing blume. I'm not sure how biblical it is to seek the Holy Ghost, at least by how seeking is practiced in many Pentecostal services. I know its biblical and even reasonable to ask God for it and even to desire it, however, I'm not sure the bible teaches its something that should be sought after in the manner that Pentecostal churches encourage people to seek. What are your thoughts?

[easter]

How about this perspective on receiving the Holy Ghost...

Ephesians 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation-- having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

All believers are promised the Holy Ghost

John 16:13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. 14 He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. 15 All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you.

The Holy Ghost draws men to Christ so there would be no reason to believe a man would have to beg for the Holy Ghost because really He comes to man first by way of convicting the man of his sin and leading the man to Christ.This we know.
Where I'm going with this is some Christians stop there after receiving salvation and do not have the understanding that yes they are sealed by the Holy Ghost but there is a difference between that and being baptised in the Holy Ghost.
Care to clarify for me jfrog?

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by easter

How about this perspective on receiving the Holy Ghost...

Ephesians 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation-- having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

All believers are promised the Holy Ghost

John 16:13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. 14 He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. 15 All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you.

The Holy Ghost draws men to Christ so there would be no reason to believe a man would have to beg for the Holy Ghost because really He comes to man first by way of convicting the man of his sin and leading the man to Christ.This we know.
Where I'm going with this is some Christians stop there after receiving salvation and do not have the understanding that yes they are sealed by the Holy Ghost but there is a difference between that and being baptised in the Holy Ghost.
Care to clarify for me jfrog?

I have only been speaking of the type of Holy Ghost that is spoken of in Acts 2:38. If you take Acts 2:38 to be about the baptism of the Holy Ghost then that is what I have been speaking of. If you take Acts 2:38 to mean the sealing of the Holy Ghost then that is what I have been speaking of.

I have been posting with the impression that Acts 2:38 was about the baptism of the Holy Ghost. I have not discussed whether there are two types of Holy Ghost, the baptism and the sealing or whether there is just one type of Holy Ghost.

[easter]

Originally Posted by jfrog

I have only been speaking of the type of Holy Ghost that is spoken of in Acts 2:38. If you take Acts 2:38 to be about the baptism of the Holy Ghost then that is what I have been speaking of. If you take Acts 2:38 to mean the sealing of the Holy Ghost then that is what I have been speaking of.

I have been posting with the impression that Acts 2:38 was about the baptism of the Holy Ghost. I have not discussed whether there are two types of Holy Ghost, the baptism and the sealing or whether there is just one type of Holy Ghost.

No there is only one Holy Ghost.I'm trying to figure out why some are only sealed and don't receive nothing more.Like the gifts and some Christians this day and time don't believe the gifts are still operating.

[notofworks]

Ok, so if the statement is...having sin in your life can keep you from getting the Holy Ghost, would it be an automatic that if one has sin in his/her life, one cannot receive the Holy Ghost?

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by easter

No there is only one Holy Ghost.I'm trying to figure out why some are only sealed and don't receive nothing more.Like the gifts and some Christians this day and time don't believe the gifts are still operating.

Is there anything that someone can do to get God to give them more? If so, what?

[easter]

Originally Posted by jfrog

Is there anything that someone can do to get God to give them more? If so, what?

Pray! Thank You jfrog