If A Man Die

[Michael The Disciple]

MB

I agree Job looked forward to resurrection. What has that got to do with sleeping, though?

Well look at the context.

17:13 If I wait, the grave (Sheol) is mine house: I have made my bed in the darkness.
17:14 I have said to corruption, Thou art my father: to the worm, Thou art my mother, and my sister.
17:15 And where is now my hope? as for my hope, who shall see it?
17:16 They shall go down to the bars of the pit (Sheol), when our rest together is in the dust. Job 17:13-16

Job says the grave will be HIS (not my bodies) house. He says he will make HIS (not his bodies) BED in the darkness. The metaphors are perfect. He will be in the darkness of the grave. That is where he will make his bed. What does one do ON A BED? A bed is for SLEEPING.

Job was saying his death would be like he was asleep. Jesus used the metaphor about Lazarus. The Bible is full of that terminology. So the answer as to what does Job waiting for the resurrection have to do with sleeping is very simple.

He is explaining the WAITING PERIOD between his death and his resurrection. Remember the first thing said is IF I WAIT. He said nothing about instant Heaven. Why? The Spirit never inspired him to do so. Rather it inspired him to say what he did say. We learn from what is taught not from what is not taught.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Well look at the context.

17:13 If I wait, the grave (Sheol) is mine house: I have made my bed in the darkness.
17:14 I have said to corruption, Thou art my father: to the worm, Thou art my mother, and my sister.
17:15 And where is now my hope? as for my hope, who shall see it?
17:16 They shall go down to the bars of the pit (Sheol), when our rest together is in the dust. Job 17:13-16

Job says the grave will be HIS (not my bodies) house. He says he will make HIS (not his bodies) BED in the darkness. The metaphors are perfect. He will be in the darkness of the grave. That is where he will make his bed. What does one do ON A BED? A bed is for SLEEPING.

Job was saying his death would be like he was asleep. Jesus used the metaphor about Lazarus. The Bible is full of that terminology. So the answer as to what does Job waiting for the resurrection have to do with sleeping is very simple.

He is explaining the WAITING PERIOD between his death and his resurrection. Remember the first thing said is IF I WAIT. He said nothing about instant Heaven. Why? The Spirit never inspired him to do so. Rather it inspired him to say what he did say. We learn from what is taught not from what is not taught.

That was a good objective post. Thanks.

As we both know, we must weigh forth the issue with all scriptures. Before the cross, those of us who believe in present torment in hell believe the saints in Sheol did not suffer. Neither were they in Heaven. Sheol contained both the saints and sinners, while sinners suffered in Gehenna whereas the saints did not. It is as though Sheol contained two parts to it. Gehenna and Abraham's bosom. This accounts for the gulf in Christ's words about Lazarus and the rich man.

Anyway, Job never knew of anything other than a resurrection to one day come. What he said did not contradict anything in the rest of the bible. You just cannot write about what you do not know about.

Jesus said hell has fire. And hell is known to be cast into the lake of fire later. You said hellfire is only for those who LIVE again and are cast into the lake of fire. But that does not agree with the thought that hell fire is not the fire from the lake but from hell. And if hell is cast into the lake of fire, then it is from one state of fire to another, with the lake of fire being permanent as opposed to the temporal fire of hell. All this demands that Job's words refer to his body. His body is as much a part of him as is his soul and spirit. We are spirit, soul and body.

Again, Paul's words of being absent from the body to be present with the Lord find no place in soul-sleep theology. The soul remains with the body in the grave and rises with the body to be with the Lord. There is no absence from the body in such a scenario. All of this demands Job's words to refer to the body.