Are you talking about unbelievers? If so - it is their lack of faith that is the root cause.
Or are you speaking of those who who have been converted calling on the name of the Lord Jesus (even at baptism) yet the minister's invocation does not match ours?
Brother Hoover, at the end of the day anyone who has not obeyed the command of scripture to be baptized in the name of Jesus, has not been obedient to scripture.
I do not know how one can be saved and be disobedient to scripture.
I will however, leave room for God to do what ever he wants to. Just dont ask me to condone some act (or lack thereof) that leaves one unbaptized in Jesus name.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Brother Hoover, at the end of the day anyone who has not obeyed the command of scripture to be baptized in the name of Jesus, has not been obedient to scripture.
I do not know how one can be saved and be disobedient to scripture.
I will however, leave room for God to do what ever he wants to. Just dont ask me to condone some act (or lack thereof) that leaves one unbaptized in Jesus name.
No doubt it is God that will judge - and that is a good thing.
The question that has never been answered to my satisfaction, is; What qualifies as being "unbaptized in Jesus name"?
All partisanship aside, if someone is praying to, and thanking Jesus at the time of their baptism, I would never venture to say they were NOT baptised in Jesus name - irregardless what a third party did not say.
Indeed, I feel I would place my own salvation in jeapordy if I wrongly judge fellow brethren unto damnation. That is not to say we shouldn't argue particulars and what it is that constitutes Apostolic fashion, either.
I know you may disagree Ferd... Bless you in any case!
__________________ "It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
No doubt it is God that will judge - and that is a good thing.
The question that has never been answered to my satisfaction, is; What qualifies as being "unbaptized in Jesus name"?
All partisanship aside, if someone is praying to, and thanking Jesus at the time of their baptism, I would never venture to say they were NOT baptised in Jesus name - irregardless what a third party did not say.
Indeed, I feel I would place my own salvation in jeapordy if I wrongly judge fellow brethren unto damnation. That is not to say we shouldn't argue particulars and what it is that constitutes Apostolic fashion, either.
I know you may disagree Ferd... Bless you in any case!
Honestly I have moved to some degree beynd arguing particulars in some areas. Exactly when "the blood is applied" is one of them
What I have come to realize is that far too often (and I am not saying this about you) we have a huge number that are just looking for an excuse to no follow the scripture. I am not giving them a pass. Not ever. To me that would put my salvation in jepordy.
I am perfectly comfortable letting God be God, but I do know that God has given us all his word and his word has a simple command. That command is to be baptized in his name. I am not willing to complicate it, use some symantical argument to allow for the trinitarinan formula to satisfy it, or to suggest that anyone is ok who simply has decided that since it is just and outward sign, and they arent comfortable with that, that they get a pass because it isnt a salvation issue.
Im not going there. I remain skeptical that any person can be both saved and disobedient to scripture.
Scripture commands baptism in Jesus Name. period. How does anyone find room to continue the discussion beyond that point?
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Im not going there. I remain skeptical that any person can be both saved and disobedient to scripture.
Scripture commands baptism in Jesus Name. period. How does anyone find room to continue the discussion beyond that point?
But here's the problem..... people who have been baptized with the minister repeating Matt. 28:19 feel like they have been obedient to scripture. They are directly repeating Jesus' statement.
Will God send them to hell over that? I honestly don't know.
But here's the problem..... people who have been baptized with the minister repeating Matt. 28:19 feel like they have been obedient to scripture. They are directly repeating Jesus' statement.
Will God send them to hell over that? I honestly don't know.
They have NOT been baptized IN THE NAME the preacher lied when he ducked them in the water. Their baptism is NOT valid and their sins have NOT been remitted. Both the preacher and the follower are lost.
Would God send someone to Hell for believing Buddah is the Way?
Would God send someone to Hell for passing out Watchtower magazines and believing Jesus is NOT God?
Would God send a good Catholic to Hell for believing in the confessional and euchrist power to save?
God probably has just shut down Hell.
But here's the problem..... people who have been baptized with the minister repeating Matt. 28:19 feel like they have been obedient to scripture. They are directly repeating Jesus' statement.
Will God send them to hell over that? I honestly don't know.
AQP, why does it matter if you know or not? The simple reality is that the bible commands it.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
AQP, why does it matter if you know or not? The simple reality is that the bible commands it.
Because as a general rule we Pentecostals have assigned everyone to hell if they've been baptized with the Matt. 28:19 formula. I don't want to do that if it is not an absolute fact.
Because as a general rule we Pentecostals have assigned everyone to hell if they've been baptized with the Matt. 28:19 formula. I don't want to do that if it is not an absolute fact.
its an absolute fact that if you have not been baptized in Jesus name, that you have not been obedient to scripture.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
AQP, why does it matter if you know or not? The simple reality is that the bible commands it.
Really AQP, just shut up and "obey!" Understanding is not an important component to faith.
Actually, since Fernando seems cranky lately, I might want to reword that so as to avoid the wrath!
On another thread someone mentioned how people are "destroyed" for a lack of knowledge. Shouldn't knowledge and understanding actually help us to believe and thus avoid "destruction?"
Really AQP, just shut up and "obey!" Understanding is not an important component to faith.
Actually, since Fernando seems cranky lately, I might want to reword that so as to avoid the wrath!
On another thread someone mentioned how people are "destroyed" for a lack of knowledge. Shouldn't knowledge and understanding actually help us to believe and thus avoid "destruction?"
You got me cranky with the magic comment. insipid.
and yes knowlege is certainly important. having a blessed understanding of what the scripture actually says is very important.
the scripture says be baptized in the name of Jesus.
thank you for pionting that out.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Hybrid Mode
