I, for one, did not have a horrible experience in church, in terms of abuse, control, that sort of thing. Not as bad as some, anyway. But I did suffer from depression, which got worse as time went on. All the talk of joy and peace did nothing but add to my despair and guilt: I figured I must have been doing something wrong, since I didn't have much joy or peace.
I looked around and saw nothing but happy people. Talk of miracles nearly every day. But the stories often didn't ring true. And there was often something behind the happy faces; a hint of something deeper, something hidden. Something like what I had. I began to wonder -- do they have the same problem I do? Are they wearing a peace and joy mask, keeping up appearances?
Occasionally, some questions were actually voiced, most often from young people, and the usual answers were given (we don't understand everything, but Jesus will always be there, etc.) may have helped some people, but not me.
Mourn my exit from the faith, if you like, but I consider it a life-saver. I'm pretty sure I'd be dead by now, if I hadn't left.
Oh, but if it does work for you, go for it! I fully understand that some people may actually "get it right". If you really do have peace and joy, that's wonderful. (Knee jerk reactions, disbelieving anything contrary to your own experience, are not helpful, IMO, in convincing anyone that you actually are getting it right. )
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
I, for one, did not have a horrible experience in church, in terms of abuse, control, that sort of thing. Not as bad as some, anyway. But I did suffer from depression, which got worse as time went on. All the talk of joy and peace did nothing but add to my despair and guilt: I figured I must have been doing something wrong, since I didn't have much joy or peace.
I looked around and saw nothing but happy people. Talk of miracles nearly every day. But the stories often didn't ring true. And there was often something behind the happy faces; a hint of something deeper, something hidden. Something like what I had. I began to wonder -- do they have the same problem I do? Are they wearing a peace and joy mask, keeping up appearances?
Occasionally, some questions were actually voiced, most often from young people, and the usual answers were given (we don't understand everything, but Jesus will always be there, etc.) may have helped some people, but not me.
Mourn my exit from the faith, if you like, but I consider it a life-saver. I'm pretty sure I'd be dead by now, if I hadn't left.
Oh, but if it does work for you, go for it! I fully understand that some people may actually "get it right". If you really do have peace and joy, that's wonderful. (Knee jerk reactions, disbelieving anything contrary to your own experience, are not helpful, IMO, in convincing anyone that you actually are getting it right. )
We have some folks that left church. They have a lot of joy. The liquid joy in a bottle. ...but hangover commeth in the morning.
We have some folks that left church. They have a lot of joy. The liquid joy in a bottle. ...but hangover commeth in the morning.
Coadie, we're not talking about people who left because they were preached a biblical standard. We're talking about spiritually and emotionally abusive leadership that devastates many people and their families.
How do we handle individuals who simply can't deal with the emotional trauma of "church" after such situations? Now, I have a house church bent here. I talk to people who break down with tears and sobbing about what's happened to them. Sometimes I'm shocked that they were affected so deeply over some things... but for that sincere true believer, being condemned over something trivial is very painful. When one's life, hopes, dreams, and identity is wrapped up in the church and that church has used, abused, exploited, or manipulated them... they experience severe emotional pain.
Coadie, we're not talking about people who left because they were preached a biblical standard. We're talking about spiritually and emotionally abusive leadership that devastates many people and their families.
Prove it.
The counselor can't discuss his patient with the pastor. You haven't spoken with the psychologist. Apparently the counselor hasn't visited the pastor and is relying on renditions from the "victum"
WE DO NOT know the other part of the "Story"
You do have a juicy story of victumhood started here. It could be a bad pastor and likeley isn't.
The larger the church, the greater the odds of a new regular complaining about how horrible the church was that they left.
A very high % of counselors would be out of business if saints used the pulpit and bible for a path for living instead of them.
Prove it.
The counselor can't discuss his patient with the pastor. You haven't spoken with the psychologist. Apparently the counselor hasn't visited the pastor and is relying on renditions from the "victum"
WE DO NOT know the other part of the "Story"
You do have a juicy story of victumhood started here. It could be a bad pastor and likeley isn't.
The larger the church, the greater the odds of a new regular complaining about how horrible the church was that they left.
A very high % of counselors would be out of business if saints used the pulpit and bible for a path for living instead of them.
Coadie - - we don't have to prove anything - this is a discussion.
Of course, we don't have all the facts - - anything we discuss here we aren't privy to all the facts.......even yours.
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Master of Science in Applied Disgruntled Religious Theorist Wrangling
PhD in Petulant Tantrum Quelling
Dean of the School of Hard Knocks
Prove it.
The counselor can't discuss his patient with the pastor. You haven't spoken with the psychologist. Apparently the counselor hasn't visited the pastor and is relying on renditions from the "victum"
WE DO NOT know the other part of the "Story"
You do have a juicy story of victumhood started here. It could be a bad pastor and likeley isn't.
The larger the church, the greater the odds of a new regular complaining about how horrible the church was that they left.
A very high % of counselors would be out of business if saints used the pulpit and bible for a path for living instead of them.
Let's say you've been working with this saint of God and are trying to get them back "into church" and the saint opens up to you about what they're going through, talks about their counseling cessions, the therapies advised, and how they feel about church. They love the Lord, they believe the Bible. It's just the emotional pain that they've experienced in church that prevents them from wanting to come. They're willing to attend smaller informal gatherings, but not your traditional church services. Let's say you know this person and have for years. Let's also say you and they attended the church where the emotional and spiritual abuse transpired. Let's say that you too experienced a degree of spiritual abuse in said church and you do know quite a bit about their personal situation and circumstances around it.
Is it possible that trying to persuade this individual to attend church could be harmful to them?
I, for one, did not have a horrible experience in church, in terms of abuse, control, that sort of thing. Not as bad as some, anyway. But I did suffer from depression, which got worse as time went on. All the talk of joy and peace did nothing but add to my despair and guilt: I figured I must have been doing something wrong, since I didn't have much joy or peace.
I looked around and saw nothing but happy people. Talk of miracles nearly every day. But the stories often didn't ring true. And there was often something behind the happy faces; a hint of something deeper, something hidden. Something like what I had. I began to wonder -- do they have the same problem I do? Are they wearing a peace and joy mask, keeping up appearances?
Occasionally, some questions were actually voiced, most often from young people, and the usual answers were given (we don't understand everything, but Jesus will always be there, etc.) may have helped some people, but not me.
Mourn my exit from the faith, if you like, but I consider it a life-saver. I'm pretty sure I'd be dead by now, if I hadn't left.
Oh, but if it does work for you, go for it! I fully understand that some people may actually "get it right". If you really do have peace and joy, that's wonderful. (Knee jerk reactions, disbelieving anything contrary to your own experience, are not helpful, IMO, in convincing anyone that you actually are getting it right. )
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Hybrid Mode
