DA No Longer an OP

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Hoovie

They aren't saying the Spirit is not recieved at all or iS inactive in the conversion process.

So is the Spirit received in part? If one truly holds to this view how can they consistently say that when one speaks in tongues it is "intitial evidence" ?
Even if one says the Spirit is for "empowerment" and not salvation, if they hold to the initial evidence doctrine then how can they CONSISTENTLY claim the one who has not spoken in tongues, does indeed have the SPirit, if tongues is the evidence. It does not follow.

Originally Posted by Hoovie

You may not understand how they hold to salvation apart from Spirit Baptism, but it is the predominate view among Pentecostals and Charismatics alike.

I understand the thoery, I don't think it is consistent with Biblical doctrine. Whether or not the view is predominate or held by the majority of pentecostals has no bearing on its truthfulness.

Originally Posted by Hoovie

Even among those who baptize in Jesus Name, I believe the majority believe salvation occurs apart from Spirit Baptism (notice I did not say the majority of UPC).

Which puts them in a real hard place, since the Bible tells us that if any man has not the Spirit of Christ he is none of His. At least the UC three steppers are consistent in their view.