Changing Churches

[Coonskinner]

Originally Posted by Ronzo

I agree here, bro... but with that in mind, you do understand that 'ministry' is held to a higher 'standard' (bad choice of words, sorry), right? I know you hold yourself very accountable.

The higher standard is acceptable, and even Scriptural.

No problem with that.

A completely unrealistic standard is something else entirely.

[Michlow]

Originally Posted by Kutless

I hear you on this MIch. This has been a year in which I have had to learn the whole forgiveness lesson(still learning) Not saying that about you...

NOt only are we expected to put up with it but are made to feel that we are hell-bound for going someplace else.

I do however think that if you change churches that you should sit back for a while. For a lot of reasons.

Actually the forgiveness part wasn't hard for me. I forgave, I have let go of the hurt and negative emotions. But the thing that I haven't done, and at this point am not willing to do is trust. I mean the first time, I didn't know any better, you know?

I was knew to faith, and I just accepted what those in authority told me. I let them twist the Bible to back up their authority, because I didn't know any better.

I am still trying to undo all the wrong teaching and twisted spiritual development that was brought about by their deviation. I don't hate the ministry, but neither do I trust them.

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

A completely unrealistic standard is something else entirely.

Aside from being human and one that should lead by example (and take that example seriously and with humility), I don't know what else people can expect from leaders.

Leaders serve and domineering is not serving... is it?


Not saying you are one of those domineering leaders. I actually don't think you are.


Trust is earned...

[Kutless]

Originally Posted by Ronzo

I'm not defending do-no-wrong preachers, friend. I know there are freakolas out there... and I don't defend their right to be freakolas.

But I gotta tell ya... I'm not going to walk into a church and make that spiritual abuse thing a part of my conversations with the pastor... for a LONG time... until I feel comfortable there and with him...

If I never get to the point that I feel comfortable enough to talk about it, he'll never have to worry about hearing it from me because I won't be there anymore.

I agree with you to a point. That point wold be that the person in the initial subject should have used a little more wisdom in the approach. But to feel as though a pastor is unapproachable is unexceptable in ministry IMO. And I have definitely been there.

Originally Posted by Kutless

But to feel as though a pastor is unapproachable is unexceptable in ministry IMO.

An 'unapproachable pastor' is not a pastor...

[Kutless]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

Brother,

Believe me, I have seen my share of preachers doing wrong things.

I'm not a member of that club you referenced.

But the truth of the matter is, we are all human beings, and sometimes the saints need to know that the road runs both ways.

thankyou for you honesty here Bro Coon. I wouldn't have put you in that club.

I agree that saints can be CRAZEEE as well. Still not for sure if I would have went down that road right off the bat. How about a little love first?

[Kutless]

Originally Posted by Michlow

Actually the forgiveness part wasn't hard for me. I forgave, I have let go of the hurt and negative emotions. But the thing that I haven't done, and at this point am not willing to do is trust. I mean the first time, I didn't know any better, you know?

I was knew to faith, and I just accepted what those in authority told me. I let them twist the Bible to back up their authority, because I didn't know any better.

I am still trying to undo all the wrong teaching and twisted spiritual development that was brought about by their deviation. I don't hate the ministry, but neither do I trust them.

A book I read referred to it as stones that continue to resurface. Forgiveness is a continuous action.

The book also made points that forgiveness has steps.

1. Forgive them

2. Forgive yourself.

3. Forgive God

4. Ask God not to hold it against them.

Number 4 is were I'm stuck.

[Kutless]

Originally Posted by Ronzo

An 'unapproachable pastor' is not a pastor...

Not according to "The List".

Originally Posted by Kutless

Not according to "The List".

Not sure I follow... can you clarify that when you get a chance?

[Michlow]

Originally Posted by Kutless

A book I read referred to it as stones that continue to resurface. Forgiveness is a continuous action.

The book also made points that forgiveness has steps.

1. Forgive them

2. Forgive yourself.

3. Forgive God

4. Ask God not to hold it against them.

Number 4 is were I'm stuck.

Well to be brutally honest here, #4 did not pose a problem for me, most likely because I easily saw how I perpetuated the abuse to other family members, as I was considered "the most spiritual" and took it as my personal duty to see that they "followed all the rules".

Seeing as I did it, because I was messed up and didn't know any better, knowing that it came out of sincere concern for their eternal destination and God eventually got through to me, and forgave me, as did my family, well, it is easy for me to view them as being well meaning, but confused, and wanting God to get through to them like he did to me.