Responding to a Trinitarian

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by Aquila

For me and my Trinitarian friends the battle ground is the word "person". In Modalism, each mode has a distinct sense of self-consciousness. For example, the Father has a distinct sense of divine self consciousness. The Son has a distinct sense of human self consciousness. In Trinitarianism a subsistent center of self-consciousness is a person. Therefore, to them, what we call modes are persons. And by their definition they are right. The Modalist defines "person" in a way more akin to how they would describe "being". So we say God is one person in three modes... they say God is a single being in three persons. lol

The biggest difference is that we make a BIG deal out of it and most trinnies are blissfully ignorant that there is any difference in what we believe unless we explain it. Having lived some 40 years in trinitarian faiths I can promise you that the majority of mainstream Christians have no idea that Oneness exists. They believe that they believe in one God, the God of the bible and his son Jesus Christ who is God and the Holy Spirit who is also God.

Whether or not we are willing to believe them about that is up to us.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Titus2woman

The biggest difference is that we make a BIG deal out of it and most trinnies are blissfully ignorant that there is any difference in what we believe unless we explain it. Having lived some 40 years in trinitarian faiths I can promise you that the majority of mainstream Christians have no idea that Oneness exists. They believe that they believe in one God, the God of the bible and his son Jesus Christ who is God and the Holy Spirit who is also God.

Whether or not we are willing to believe them about that is up to us.

I have not found this to be true in my experience. Even now there are thousands of so called "Apologetics" sites on the net that condemn Oneness doctrine. People have been literally killed because they would not accept the Trinity.

It is not a quibble over words. Jesus taught he was our Father come as a man. Trins will never agree to that.

[UnTraditional]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I have not found this to be true in my experience. Even now there are thousands of so called "Apologetics" sites on the net that condemn Oneness doctrine. People have been literally killed because they would not accept the Trinity.

It is not a quibble over words. Jesus taught he was our Father come as a man. Trins will never agree to that.

The trinitarian doctrine does not fully believe that in Christ dwells ALL the fullness of the Godhead bodily. They believe He is deity, but in their description of Him, He is a lesser deity than the Father, and not fully God. Makes a big difference, doesn't it.

I experienced this myself among the so-called tolerant trinitarians. They called Oneness heretical and declared us lost. For such tolerant people, they sure are intolerant.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by UnTraditional

The trinitarian doctrine does not fully believe that in Christ dwells ALL the fullness of the Godhead bodily. They believe He is deity, but in their description of Him, He is a lesser deity than the Father, and not fully God. Makes a big difference, doesn't it.

I experienced this myself among the so-called tolerant trinitarians. They called Oneness heretical and declared us lost. For such tolerant people, they sure are intolerant.

I believe the trinitarian claim is co-equality?

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by UnTraditional

The trinitarian doctrine does not fully believe that in Christ dwells ALL the fullness of the Godhead bodily. They believe He is deity, but in their description of Him, He is a lesser deity than the Father, and not fully God. Makes a big difference, doesn't it.

I experienced this myself among the so-called tolerant trinitarians. They called Oneness heretical and declared us lost. For such tolerant people, they sure are intolerant.

Well... since there are probably as many views of trinity as there are trinnies and as many views of oneness as there are OPs (or at least that is my experience) I can't completely disagree with you except to say that for you to boldly state what a group of people believe is kind of amazing.

I am a very strict monotheist, possibly a modalist and I am willing to bet (if I were the betting type) that you could not voice my theology accurately. If you tried I would be able to find areas where I was not in agreement... I know this because some have tried and they never get it right from either camp... So I am 100% certain that you have not given a good explanation of what trinitarians believe.

And not you personally really... but everyone who tries to read another person's thoughts, feelings and beliefs.

[RandyWayne]

When we left the Catholic faith the big eye opener for all of us was the invalidity of Saint/Mary worship. Learning about "oneness" was not, and never was, a big revelation for anyone in our family. Learning that it was such a huge point of contention from the point of view of many OP's WAS a bit more revealing.

[bbyrd009]

Let me tell you, it is straight comedy, looking in from without. Modalist clowns. ICP is a better witness, imo.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Let me tell you, it is straight comedy, looking in from without. Modalist clowns. ICP is a better witness, imo.

Please tell me the reference to ICP isn't to the band I think its referencing lol.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

Let me tell you, it is straight comedy, looking in from without. Modalist clowns. ICP is a better witness, imo.

Why are you calling Modalists clowns? That does not seem like a good witness to me IMO

[Jay]

I have found that many Trinitarians do know about the Oneness issue, although those who are half-hearted, Sunday morning, Christmas, Easter, marryin', and buryin' 'Christsians' are worse than ignorant about any of the Bible doctrines.