The church in history

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

Where does Luther fit into all of this????

The beginning of the protestant reformation....

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

The beginning of the protestant reformation....

That's what I thought. I never understood how a Christ lover could be a Jew hater. Christ God in the flesh was a Jew.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

That's what I thought. I never understood how a Christ lover could be a Jew hater. Christ God in the flesh was a Jew.

maybe so but the fact is that was the genesis of what is now the evangelical movement...

the irony is many evangelics make it an issue there is no visible oneness group in every year, century etc etc yet not only can they not do the same before recent history relatively speaking but they often appeal to history to support doctrines like the trinity despite chants of sola scriptura...

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

That's what I thought. I never understood how a Christ lover could be a Jew hater. Christ God in the flesh was a Jew.

I don't think you understand Luther. Luther came to oppose Judaism later in life. He wasn't a 'Jew hater' in the sense most people think. People think Luther's 'anti-Jewishness' was on the same level or of the same kind as say Hitler's. Not even close. Hitler hated Jews* because he believed they were a race with a genetic predisposition to subversion and communism. Luther hated Jews because he believed their religion was vile, antiChristian, and contrary to good morals.



*Note: There is some disagreement about hitler's views on Jews, due to the fact that there were, in fact, Jews who supported the NSDAP program and who were members of the Nazi Party (Hess, for example, as well as some others.) There is also the persistent rumour that Hitler may have been partially Jewish himself.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

Fruit of the Spirit is not tongues.

Yeah, guess I didn't make myself clear. I was talking about getting the Holy Ghost like in Acts 2 and wasn't refering to Galatians 5:22-23.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

maybe so but the fact is that was the genesis of what is now the evangelical movement...

the irony is many evangelics make it an issue there is no visible oneness group in every year, century etc etc yet not only can they not do the same before recent history relatively speaking but they often appeal to history to support doctrines like the trinity despite chants of sola scriptura...

I sometimes wonder what the Church would look like today if not for Luther.

I guess because we were Oneness at onetime and today we attend Trinitarian churhes I don't pay attention to the Godhead arguments. I really say that by and large we are saying the same thing.

I have a friend of mine who was a UPC pastor at onetime who helped me over a lunch one day I still carried Godhead baggage. He told me that we care more about the 1 into 3 or the 3 into 1. I kind of settled it for me.

Honestly in the AG many of the message that I have heard sounded very Oneness to me.

History has showed us that were people that held onto what looks to be Oneness in the Godhead view. Your stage name being one.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Julian

Yeah, guess I didn't make myself clear. I was talking about getting the Holy Ghost like in Acts 2:38 and wasn't refering to Galatians 5:22-23.

Julian I understand you. Show me your tongues and I will show you my fruit.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

Julian I understand you. Show me your tongues and I will show you my fruit.

How can I show you what cannot be seen?

John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth , and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canstnot tell whence it cometh , and whither it goeth : so is every one that is born of the Spirit

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Julian

How can I show you what cannot be seen?

John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth , and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canstnot tell whence it cometh , and whither it goeth : so is every one that is born of the Spirit

Are tongues the only evidence of being filled with the Spirit???

I for the most part agree with the initial evidence doctrine.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

Are tongues the only evidence of being filled with the Spirit???

I for the most part agree with the initial evidence doctrine.

When you are filled with the Spirit you will have the fruits of the Spirit.