I'm leaving my church. Please pray.

[StillStanding]

This thread breaks my heart! It's very honorable that you and your family served the church so faithfully over the years. I pray that either you resolve the situation with your pastor, or find another church where you will feel comfortable and appreciated. In any case, I pray that God directs your path and that you find work.

I know that your patience with everything is wearing thin, but remember God's perfect patience with us. Maybe, just maybe, God is putting you in a place where you can handle his blessings and answers to your prayers.

[CC1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzVdEyHicz8

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

LOL! Some people are like that anyway. It seems to me, from observation, the more organizational meetings they attend, the more of an entitlement mentality they gain. At least, that has been our experience.

There are all kinds.

I have been under great pastors and I have been under lousy pastors.
I realize early on that pastors are humans and should be accepted as humans, you will find some that are really leaders and some that are tyrants.

The ministers have a lot of their own problems and they also have to deal with the problems of others, because of that, I tend to give ministers a break and sometimes simply overlook some of their comments or words.

I was a pastor in a small church and I realize that being in the ministry is not an easy calling. I had my own troubles and then I had to deal with the troubles of the church members, sometimes I was a little edgy, and it was hard to keep a loving tone of voice.

[seguidordejesus]

The thing that strikes me as strange (this is not an indictment of the original poster) is that the pastor thought enough of you to support your move to Mexico, but when you return, he is cold? There's no doubt things you're not sharing, and aren't required to, but do you think there's something you're not considering when thinking through this matter? Was there something between you that might have caused offense?

Either way, the whole situation seems toxic...I'm not sure the answer to my questions above would change my desire to leave.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

There are all kinds.

I have been under great pastors and I have been under lousy pastors.
I realize early on that pastors are humans and should be accepted as humans, you will find some that are really leaders and some that are tyrants.

The ministers have a lot of their own problems and they also have to deal with the problems of others, because of that, I tend to give ministers a break and sometimes simply overlook some of their comments or words.

I was a pastor in a small church and I realize that being in the ministry is not an easy calling. I had my own troubles and then I had to deal with the troubles of the church members, sometimes I was a little edgy, and it was hard to keep a loving tone of voice.

I agree with your post, especially the bold. We chose not to get involved in the ministry because of the politics. Being involved with the youth did give me a sense of what you were saying about being edgy. I remember one day thinking, "Today I understand how easy it could be to be rude and impatient over the pulpit."

My post was a reflection on the bad leaders I have known. I should have given the good leaders a break like you have. I do apologize for that.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by seguidordejesus

The thing that strikes me as strange (this is not an indictment of the original poster) is that the pastor thought enough of you to support your move to Mexico, but when you return, he is cold? There's no doubt things you're not sharing, and aren't required to, but do you think there's something you're not considering when thinking through this matter? Was there something between you that might have caused offense?

Either way, the whole situation seems toxic...I'm not sure the answer to my questions above would change my desire to leave.

We actually had not yet "moved" to Mexico. It was well understood we'd only be there for the Summer and would be returning. Our actual "move" is to come later as we seek which avenue now to take since the UPC no longer sends missionaries there. He well understood this. There was absolutely no misunderstanding on this issue. There is absolutely nothing that I'm withholding here. I have wracked my brain trying to think of what could have caused offense. If there is, should he not care enough to confront me privately? From his message Wednesday night, he clearly holds to the belief that financial struggles stem from a lack of giving, period. He left no room for any consideration that faithful tithe payers also experience financial troubles.

[StillStanding]

I agree with the suggestion to meet with the pastor at a coffee shop or public place. There is little chance that offensive conversation will happen in public. You might be surprised at how understanding that the pastor might be when he knows the whole story. Who knows?

Meeting in the pastor's office puts you at a disadvantage. 1. You will be intimidated. 2. The pastor may feel he in on holy ground, and may feel more comfortable to be crass and offensive.

[jediwill83]

I think one of the things that bothers you so much is that its been drilled in us to "respect the man of God" and that translates into wanting to please those in authority...we do this consciously or unconsciously.Its almost like the reaction we would have when a parent expresses disapproval...we go into a mode of distress trying to regain that approval which would work if you indeed had done something wrong....the problem here is that there are two different views on scripture here that are clashing so you have some choices.....knuckle under and stay compromising what you know to be true or HIS view changes and there is reconciliation or you stay and the conflict escalates...or leave to do your part to bring peace to the situation.There is reflexive panic when there is an attack from the pulpit and I know you have done alot of soul searching and self examination examining motives and attitudes but you have to stand upon the Word....not traditions of man.Its never recorded that the early church browbeat their members to give in fact the commandment was for every man tk give what he had determined in his heart to give freely and without coercion... its only then that you can truly give cheerfully.When troubles happen its human nature for others to assume some sort of sin was involved...it happened with Job and even the disciples were prone to it asking Jesus about the sin in the blind mans life that caused his blindness but as the previous poster said "It rains upon the just and the unjust".....brother I love you and im praying for you and your family....I cant stop the rain but maybe I can stand with you and hold the umbrella.....sorry for the ramble but I just got off a 48 and I be's tired.lol

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Originalist

We actually had not yet "moved" to Mexico. It was well understood we'd only be there for the Summer and would be returning. Our actual "move" is to come later as we seek which avenue now to take since the UPC no longer sends missionaries there. He well understood this. There was absolutely no misunderstanding on this issue. There is absolutely nothing that I'm withholding here. I have wracked my brain trying to think of what could have caused offense. If there is, should he not care enough to confront me privately? From his message Wednesday night, he clearly holds to the belief that financial struggles stem from a lack of giving, period. He left no room for any consideration that faithful tithe payers also experience financial troubles.

Do they have MLM in Mexico?

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by CC1

Do they have MLM in Mexico?

Yes. Mexico is a tough place for MLM's though because it a very "backstabbing" culture. I hate to say it, but it is true. Trying to steal someone's downline is common in the MLM's down there. Though it did happen to me here, backstabbing in general permeates Mexican culture. On the one hand, they act all unified on things like immigration. But within their own community they cut each others throats without blinking.